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Putting Cory Joseph in Perspective

After the annihilation of the Spurs third stringers at the hands of the Blazers, the negativity surrounding Cory Joseph has risen to all time high levels. Granted, it's still pretty insignificant compared to the stratospheric amounts of vitriol guys like Richard Jefferson, Matt Bonner or DeJuan Blair get from their respective "haters" but it's getting to the point where people seem to have given up on Cory, which is almost worse (remember when your mom would say she was not mad, she was just dissappointed? it's like that). While it's necessary to admit that what we've seen from the Spurs' young point guard has been less than encouraging, I believe it's important to keep things in perspective when it comes to young players on stacked teams, especially in a crazy season like this one.

Star-divide

I know that the lockout and the schedule that resulted from it have been used enough times as an excuse that most of us roll our eyes when they're brought up, but the reality is, it's been hard for most players and teams to adapt to them and that goes double for rookies and young players in general. While top tier talents like Kyrie Irving and Ricky Rubio have been able to make the transition to the next level easily, the lack of summer league and training camp and the shortening of pre-season had to be a big blow for the majority of rookies. Point guards in particular always have a difficult time adjusting to the pro game and those problems seem to have intensified this season. Even highly touted players like Brandon Knight, Kemba Walker and Jimmer Fredette have struggled mightily at times while not showing improvement in their game since leaving college.

If the guys that were so high on everybody's draft boards have had a hard time refining their game in post-lockout conditions, it should be no surprise that a guy that was considered a likely second round pick like Joseph has as well. I don't mean to excuse all of Cory's failures, and say they're due to lack of a normal off-season, but it's hard to imagine that he would not have benefited from more time working with the training staff and the chance to pick up tips while practicing with veteran PGs like Tony Parker and T.J. Ford. Unfortunately the lockout and its "no contact between players and team" rules and the compressed schedule made those essential steps in Cory's development impossible. His troubles getting his work visa didn't exactly helped, either. Joseph basically had to transition from one level to the next without the help that rookies from other draft classes receive while playing one of the toughest positions for a young player on the NBA.

The easiest way to dismiss what I just wrote would be to cite Kawhi Leonard as someone that, while not being a PG, doesn't seem fazed at all by coming into a team not knowing the system while managing to, in fact, exceed expectations. The big difference between the two Spurs rookies is that Leonard had elite physical tools and a couple of NBA ready skills (rebounding and defense) coming in; that's why he was selected with the 15th pick instead of the 29th and why most pundits thought he should have gone higher. Joseph, on the other hand, has ideal size for the position but only mediocre athleticism and his point guard instincts are not yet fully developed. The two skills that got him picked in the first round (3-point shooting and perimeter defense) have not yet translated to this level, but the Spurs' scouts thought he had enough upside to warrant the choice.

Kawhi-leonard-corey-joseph

Not all rookies are created equal

While comparing Joseph with lottery-picked point guards would be silly, there's a case to be made against him by noting that other PGs who were selected close to or lower than Joseph have been able to overcome the same tough situation he was in and produce. Norris Cole, who was selected one spot higher than Cory, and even Isaiah Thomas, who was selected with the last pick of the draft, have had better seasons than our rookie so far. While it's entirely possible that they are just plain better players and could go on to have better careers, for now I would simply chuck it up to fit, role and NBA-readiness (both Cole and Thomas are 23) more than skill, since the sample size is too small to allow definitive judgements. Cole is playing for a Miami Heat team that has two of the top five players in the league who also happen to be fantastic playmakers. His role is to back up a mediocre point guard in Mario Chalmers. If he can play acceptable defense and hit open shots with some level of consistency he is doing fine; if he doesn't, his team won't really sweat it. Thomas is kind of in the opposite position. He is the only traditional point guard on a Kings team that lacks playmakers and struggles moving the ball. Any guard that doesn't consider shooting his first and second option is going to be seen as an asset and get playing time in a team that has notorious chuckers Tyreke Evans, Marcus Thornton and John Salmons in the back court. The Kings' reality, coupled with his high energy style of play and interesting narrative, makes it easy to see why Thomas is getting recognition.
Joseph hasn't been so lucky. He's been forced into the fray due to injuries and is expected to back up one of the top PGs in the league on a team that relies on ball movement, dribble penetration, expert pick and roll execution and a steady hand from its guards. It is impossible for him not to disappoint.

Having said that, even I, the founder of the Cory Joseph bandwagon, can see that Joseph is not looking good out there and It's hard to determine if he would excel in a better situation. He seems almost scared most of the time, too tentative for his own good. His 3-point shot, once considered a strength coming out of college is now a liability (.413 in college, .250 as a pro on 2-8 shooting) and he is having a hard time finishing close to the rim around NBA athletes (.429 eFG% from close range. For reference, Parker's is .642). He was consider raw as a playmaker and we can clearly see why when he dribbles aimlessly and gets trapped easily on pick and rolls. Defensively he is not showing the peskiness and awareness that some thought would earn his keep until he shed his combo-guard husk and became a full-fledged floor general. Clearly, he shouldn't be getting minutes for a playoff team. But he was never meant to. Not this year anyway.

I'm sure the Spurs were hoping he was going to be able to provide spot minutes if needed, but Joseph was drafted on potential. Some pundits thought he should have stayed in UT for at least another year so he could develop and the Spurs decision to bring T.J. Ford into the mix is a clear sign that they agreed that Joseph was at least one year away from being able to produce.

4f072831eb7d9

This is the jersey Cory Joseph should be wearing right now.

Next season Cory should find himself in a better position. A summer working on his shot and learning the playbook with the assistant coaches should make him a better offensive weapon. Watching game tape on the best PGs in the game and improving his fundamentals could render him a solid defensive option off the bench. And having a full year to adjust to the NBA lifestyle and level of play should do wonders for his comfort level, like it did for guys like Goran Dragic and Jeff Teague. His fate and the way his career develops will depend on his commitment to improve and the situation in which he finds himself in. If he's forced to play a bigger role than his ready for, he could end up struggling to find a place in the league like fellow 29th pick Toney Douglas, but if his development is handled the right way, I'm convinced he could be a solid rotation player.

For now, I and every other Spurs fan expects Cory to be in Austin when Ford returns, where he should have been this whole time honing his skills if not for injuries. Had he been there I'm sure he would have made a good enough impression to not be the target of our disdain. Hell, maybe he would even be getting the "point guard of the future" treatment from fans. Or not. I can see him backing up Parker for the near future just as easily as I can see him playing in Europe in 3 years. That's what happens with rookies drafted on potential: it's really hard to project what they will become. I know Spurs fans are not used to watching incompetent play from young players and have no patience for it but I think we should keep things in perspective and show a little faith in the young Canadian and the front office that selected him, at least for now. I'm not saying he shouldn't be criticized when he plays poorly, but all criticism should be framed on the context of the tough situation Joseph is in as a 20-year-old, one-and-done project pick. He might prove the most pessimistic of us right and become the latest wasted first rounder. Or he might surprise even the most optimistic of us. I, for one, am willing to wait to find out which is it.

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Nice article. Good timing. :)

I’m going to stick by my claim from that other thread and say he’ll be pretty good in a few more years. Taking him away from Austin hurt him a lot though. I feel like the Spurs should have taken a guy who has a few years, even from D-League to pick p the spot PG minutes.

I know Spurs fans are not used to watching incompetent play from young players and have no patience for it but I think we should keep things in perspective and show a little faith in the young Canadian and the front office that selected him

The funny thing is that the Spurs do this well. It’s just most of the time overseas so it’s lost and not front and center due to that. That said, PG is one of the toughest positions to get quality at. And time is something the Spurs have, with TJ and Manu.

Winter is coming

by grego21 on Feb 23, 2012 2:03 AM CST reply actions  

As a UT alum, I got to watch a lot of Cory Joseph last season. He’s 6’3 185 and he’s not an exceptional athlete; it seemed pretty clear he would need 2-3 years in college to refine his game to be ready to play in the NBA. I was stunned when he declared and shocked he actually got picked in the first round.

But in a draft as weak as last year’s, grabbing a 19-year old McDonald’s All-American at No. 29 and stashing him in the D-League isn’t a bad gamble.

by tjarks on Feb 23, 2012 2:33 AM CST reply actions  

I was upset when CuJo declared also, as I thought he needed AT LEAST one more year in college (especially in light if Ricky’s sudden “lack of coaching” the past 2-3 years)… But, when our Spurs grabbed him, I thought it was a great opportunity for him to learn.
The kid is YOUNG y’all. Relax, we put up with more from Pain-oh!
;)

by In the 666 on Feb 23, 2012 9:16 AM CST via mobile up reply actions  

I dont have a problem with joseph … he is part of the future
But sometimes the game is very stressful and when I see cory doing nothing there, well….

by cuentaluis1 on Feb 23, 2012 3:02 AM CST reply actions  

I laughed at “sometimes the game is very stressful” because it’s so true.

I would like to get a little more inside, myself -- Pau Gasol

by silverandblack_davis on Feb 23, 2012 4:42 AM CST up reply actions  

When Pop introduced his starting lineup at the Blazers game he made a “fumbo” and said…at 3 it’s Cory Alexander. Why was that an instant classic? Because Cory Alexander was the 29th pick of the 1995 NBA draft by the Spurs. He went on to play for 3 or 4 more teams. His career averages are 5.5 and 2.7 assists. He is now working as a radio commentator. Sometimes rocky starts are only pebbles in life. Go Cojo.

by indiancharlie on Feb 23, 2012 7:00 AM CST reply actions  

If not for Ford’s injury, Joseph would be with the Toros right now.

(Full disclaimer: I hate everyone.) -- Fred Silva and JRW

by quincyscott on Feb 23, 2012 7:14 AM CST via mobile reply actions  

Which makes me sad.

Winter is coming

by grego21 on Feb 23, 2012 11:57 AM CST up reply actions  

He’s only taken 8 three point attempts, it seems one or two of those may have been buzzer beater shot attempts. He makes his next attempt and he’s already up to .333. Not only is it Ford’s injury that has kept him from playing for the Toros, but the fact that after Tony no other guard has done that well running PG when pressed. On a per 36 minute basis, the top 4 at assists are Tony, TJ, Manu and Cory. Cory is nearly double the next guard, Neal. He has 3 assists for every turnover, a ratio topped only by Tony.

At the age of 20, he likely should have wound up with two full years with the Toros. Then compare him with the 22 year olds. If you were to look over the draft, it is not like there were many picks after him that are making a substantial contribution this year. He was chosen for his potential down the road, not for what he was expected to contribute this year. I’m not sure why he hasn’t been playing in Austin anyways while signing some older DLeaguer for depth on the bench other than the Spurs are being thrifty. Playing in Austin is 25 y/o Dentmon and 27 y/o Squeaky Johnson, they’re not particularly future prospects. Even better might have been signing former Spur Blake Ahearn.

by Alamo on Feb 23, 2012 7:58 AM CST reply actions  

The problem with picks 28-30 is you basically have to pay guaranteed money for a 2nd rounder. That’s why teams sometimes give those picks away. The Spurs are better than most at finding overlooked gems, but Cory was well-known. The Spurs probably figured he was young and talented enough that two years in Austin

might
develop him into a true NBA-level PG. Meanwhile his local connection to UT would also help sell Toros tickets and pay part of that guaranteed salary. TJ’s injury upset that applecart.

by doggydogworld on Feb 23, 2012 8:06 AM CST reply actions  

+1

Do or do not! There is no try!

by Spurs Yoda on Feb 23, 2012 9:14 AM CST up reply actions  

Great read. You said it all. I think the lockout has been devastating for the developpment of rookies and sophs, maybe even more for the sophomores. Looking back at 2010 draft (seen as a good one), it’s ugly to see that only a handful is contributing, even to bad teams.

by CafeCalva on Feb 23, 2012 8:18 AM CST reply actions  

Its simple. He was brought in before he was ready from the draft and the Toros. Send him back to Austin this year, then see how he looks after the summer league.

Bring back the Ford Focus already!

Do or do not! There is no try!

by Spurs Yoda on Feb 23, 2012 9:12 AM CST reply actions  

Meh… whoever is loosing patience with Cory must be delusional. He might have been a reach. He might have been a steal. It is too early to tell. He should not even be playing in the big leagues yet.

"If an expert says it can't be done, get another expert"
- DBG

by LasEspuelas on Feb 23, 2012 10:08 AM CST reply actions  

I remember a lot were losing patience with Manu in his first season. So long ago, but funny. Parker, as well. Oh wait, people have still been on Parker not too long ago….. I remember Hill being better than Parker a year or two ago!

Winter is coming

by grego21 on Feb 23, 2012 4:42 PM CST up reply actions  

Should have taken him in the second round and then send him to europe for 2 years. IMO the D-league is not good place to develop players because of the weak competition IMO.

But that train already passed. Right now Joseph needs to really work in his off hand dribbling and court vision

"He was just a young skinny guy who looked like a winner. We didn’t know he was going to be as good as he is."
—Popovich on Manu Ginobili

by spursfan87 on Feb 23, 2012 10:57 AM CST reply actions  

The most competitive European Leagues aren’t there to develop players but to compete, so chances are he could wind up in a league where he serves as a backup to someone like former Spur Curtis Jerrells. You also wind up with the problem that you can’t simply call up a player from the Italian League if you have injuries, and if they’re doing well there they might figure that they get better money there than filling a role in the NBA. Eric Dawson recently mentioned that he could have been making more money in Europe, but as his dream was to play in the NBA he knew it was best that he stick with the DLeague.

by Alamo on Feb 23, 2012 11:35 AM CST up reply actions  

Yes, but you can’t always assume that the guy will be there, either. Spurs would have had to trade down and hope they picked the right spot to trade down on. Spurs have been decent with their drafting of PGs. Although Beno seemed to be afraid of full and half court press, his overall game is pretty good.

Winter is coming

by grego21 on Feb 23, 2012 12:05 PM CST up reply actions  

Pain-O… oof!

by In the 666 on Feb 23, 2012 4:55 PM CST via mobile up reply actions  

I’m actually on the other side of the fence in regards to Joseph. I’ve mostly been impressed by his play. His man defense is goodish and getting better. I think a training camp and a summer league will do wonders for him and we could see him as at worst a competent backup as early as next year.

"Losing doesn't build character, losing just sucks. You know, sometimes though, you've got to lose in order to be able to enjoy winning" - Ben Wallace

by SpursfanSteve on Feb 23, 2012 12:21 PM CST reply actions  

Do you guys realize he had ZERO turnovers in that Portland game? thats exceptional!
He barely knows the system, you guys need to give him a break.

by ironm8 on Feb 23, 2012 2:19 PM CST reply actions  

ha

my mom (who doesnt know a lick about basketball): "that guy is anything but World Peace"

by Chilai on Feb 23, 2012 4:10 PM CST up reply actions  

rec’d

"He was just a young skinny guy who looked like a winner. We didn’t know he was going to be as good as he is."
—Popovich on Manu Ginobili

by spursfan87 on Feb 23, 2012 5:17 PM CST up reply actions  

yeh sorta spoiled by fact FO was able to draft Tony and Manu at such low round selections. CJ still raw and needs time to develop.
Sorta surprised FO missed on Lin but FO’s successes far outnumber misses.

by i luv this site on Feb 23, 2012 3:38 PM CST reply actions  

Good post edg5, I agree with everything you said. Im not as optimistic as you, but for now lets give him time.

my mom (who doesnt know a lick about basketball): "that guy is anything but World Peace"

by Chilai on Feb 23, 2012 4:11 PM CST reply actions  

I think worst case scenario is Anthony Carter- who had a long career as a journeyman and consistent backup.

"Losing doesn't build character, losing just sucks. You know, sometimes though, you've got to lose in order to be able to enjoy winning" - Ben Wallace

by SpursfanSteve on Feb 24, 2012 2:41 AM CST reply actions  

CJ at Texas

Joseph was not the lead guard at UT. Dogus Balbay ran point and defended the opponent’s best player, while Jordan Hamilton was the primary shooter (with J’Covan Brown off the bench). Joseph was a solid complementary player but never emerged as a team leader or go-to guy. The Spurs may be expecting too much if they hope for him to develop into a play making point guard as he is not a good passer and can’t break down a defense with penetration. He does play good on ball defense and rebounds well for a guard. Not a good free throw shooter.

Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes. If they get mad, you're a mile away AND you have their shoes.

by Caradoc on Feb 24, 2012 8:28 AM CST reply actions  

Thanks for the insight. I really don’t know what the Spurs expect but I think he is young enough to develop into a good player. Jrue Holiday, admittedly a much more gifted player, wasn’t the lead guard at UCLA but has managed to develop into that role in the pros. Hopefully Cory can, too.

"Manu Ginobili is the ultimate human cheat code, the password to the rim."
-Alex Dewey

by Edg5 on Feb 24, 2012 1:48 PM CST up reply actions  

Jrue was a great example of a guy who should have stayed at UCLA (Recent UCLA Alum).

Spurs staff had a son on Cory’s team, so they got additional insight. I’m sure the Spurs did their homework.

You like me, like him though. :)

Winter is coming

by grego21 on Feb 24, 2012 2:07 PM CST up reply actions  

Nice article. I love KLeo’s face in that picture.

Both teams played hard

by Kondor on Feb 25, 2012 3:52 PM CST reply actions  

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