Get to know Argentina...and why Greece will win it all
Yes im from Argentina. Yes Im still hoping for the miracle of winning it all. But right now I think we are not even the 3rd best team.
Everyone is talking about Spain and Usa...while adding argentina a notch below. While that's somewhat acurate, I think many people are overlooking another contender: Greece. Dont sleep on them. In fact, I have them winning it all. Forget about the eurobasket. They will get their shit together. They are STACKED and ready to go. You cant say the same things about the other 3 contenders.
TEAM USA
Usual stuff: they are by far the most talented team...but are they really a team? Can they have enough cohesion to win it all? My gut says NO. A big difference with other Team usa versions is the lack of size. Maybe it doesnt hurt them much offensively, but on defense....there's just no one to protect the rim or defend the skilled big guys of some nations. Im just salivating at the thought of Scola going against these guys.
Im not sold on their perimeter shooting and experience on international competition. You've read a lot about Team Usa everywhere, so lets focus on other teams.
SPAIN
Gasol and Calderon are out. I dont care how deep is your team, those 2 are VERY important loses. That means Spain lost his best player and perenial MVP candidate. Also, the absence of Calderon means Ricky is going to see heavy minutes. Yep he is great, im a big fan of his game. But he is a 20 year old prone to lots of mistakes. Felipe Reyes can really play at the 4, but he is no Gasol, and garbajosa looks out of shape and out of game. And I havent even mentioned one of my favoite spanish players: Carlos Jimenez. He is the historic starting SF, a guy who goes unnoticed but trust me...he has always been a BIG reason behind Spain's success. Think of him as their Bruce Bowen. A difference maker.
That's 3 starting players, 3 very key players who are missing. They are still a deep team, but you are as good as the best 5 you can put on the floor.
ARGENTINA
It hurts to say this, but we were a notch below the other contenders EVEN IF MANU PLAYED. But he isnt...so I dont like our chances at all. We are old (have you hear that one before?) but experience only gets you that far. Besides, we have a couple of newcomers on the world championship. Add the fact that Oberto and Nocioni are injured and their games seem to have regressed a bit (playing for the Wizards and the Kings will do that to you) and we are royally screwed. Yes we have the guy I think will win MVP honors (Luis Scola) who can carry us for a whole tournament. But when your only real creator and playmaker is Carlos Delfino, when you are trusting him to be the outside presence....you are going to be disapointed eventually. Carlos will look like the best SG on some games, showing an all around game remniscent of the one and only Manu. And the next night he will spend the game shooting bricks from the 3 point line will avoiding any kind of contact. That's who Delfino is. He has looked AMAZIN in preparation games. But I have been disapointed so many times before.
As for the rest of the team, they are all capable players. Argentina will show its chemistry, but its not as strong as past incarnations (Magnano I really miss you....what the FUCK are you doing as Brazil's coach?). But their limitations are really obvius. There's a reason those guys play on the local argentinean league. We have a really good league, the one that produced all the great players that have acomplished so much internationally and in the NBA. But still, you cant compare it with european competition and of course the nba.
So after the starting five (NBAers Delfino, NOcioni, Scola, Oberto and one of the better point guards of europe, Pablo Prigioni) Argentina's bench looks like this:
PG-Cequeira: an injury replacement of the injury replacement of the original backup point guard (we were screwed on point guard depth before the injuries...now we have the argentinean version of Earl Boykins going against some BIG guards like Billups, Rose, Rubio, etc)
SG-Paolo Quinteros: I love this guy. I really do. He is ridicously short for a SG, but man....he may be one of the best shooters in the tournament. Expect to be surprised.
SF-Jasen: the guy that always makes the right play. Nothing spectacular about his game, just solid all around
SF-Kammerichs: you may remember this guy. The "lost Barry brother". A lanky forward who relies on atlheticism and long arms to make defensive plays and attack the rim. A poor's man Kirilenko with a lot more heart.
PF-Leo gutierrez: He is a star in the Argentinean league. He has been with the national team for like 10 years. And he always SUCKS on international competition. I have lost all my faith in Leo. He was supposed to be our Robert Horry 05. Instead he is Robert Horry 08.
C-Roman Gonzalez: he doesnt look like a baketball player (except for his stature). He looks like a fatty member of the Hells Satans or something like that. Cant jump or move much. But HE CAN PLAY. Trust me. That elbow jumper looks forced. But its going in. Great against teams lacking size. Very shitty against a defender bigger than him.
C-Juan Gutierrez: our lame attempt at an "athletic seven footer". He isnt even 7ft tall. And he is as atlhetic as Bonner. Enough said.
After all...my national team doesnt sound that bad on paper. But overall we lack speed, we lack creation, we dont have any guy who can properly defend the paint. More now than ever, we rely on team defense and offense. Enough to get to the podium? I hope so. Enough to win it all? I dont think so.
GREECE....you heard it here first!!
Basically, they have the same team that beat a much better Team Usa a couple of years ago. They are missing their star playmaker Papalukas, the big point guard that shreded Usa with pick and rolls. But still, they have enough depth to make up for it. Ex NBAer Spanoulis is really a force to be reckoned with in international play. Dude can really score. Add enough scoring talent from up and down the roster and they are very balanced (remember Sofo? he is back and fighting serbians). But that's not where their strength lies. Its their D. They are withouth a doubt the best defensive unit in the tournament. Led by all around monster Diamantidis (another personal favorite), the greeks have the cohesion, heart and chemistry to lockdown any team. I remember that Argentina beat them on the 2008 olympics just because Delfino made like 20 straight points on some uber ridicoulus contested long jumpers in the 4th quarter. Even then we needed a couple of clutch Manu plays to get the narrow win. THESE GUYS CAN DEFEND. AND REBOUND. And they are the only other team, outside Argentina, that I trust them to give their 120% effort. They have an easy path until they met us (I dont like Argentina's chances then) to the finals. And then, probably USA or spains awaits, two powerhouses that would fear the greeks even at full strength.
They have the right mix of depth, experience, chemistry, scoring, defense and heart that the other contenders are lacking. Someone can point me where to bet?
As for the other nations, they all have BIG flaws: Brazil and Turkey (backcourt), France (shooting,surrendering), Serbia (too young). They have enough to surprise the contenders on one game, but not enough to make it all the way to the top.
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We are old (have you hear that one before?) but experience only gets you that far.
Are you serious? Ever heard of the 2007 Spurs or the 2010 Celtics?
I know Argentina doesn’t have Manu, and Oberto and Nocioni may be injured, but you’re saying the same things we Spurs fans have been laughing at for the last four years.
"Age ain't nothing but a number!" - Reggie Miller after a Dice block
With experience comes age and with age comes injuries, regrettably. The Spurs and their experience haven’t truly contended for three years while the Celtics lost the crucial Game 7 allowing 30 points to be scored in the fourth quarter. They were just tired, injured, and beat-up. That is why you’ve seen the Spurs begin to remake themselves by getting younger and younger players; they wouldn’t be able to compete otherwise.
by The Augustus on Aug 24, 2010 11:00 AM CDT up reply actions
What I tried to say is that…YES experience and being older helps. But it only gets you that far if you are not talented enough. The Spurs and Celtics were old but pretty damn talented. The same cant be said of Argentina. We have a couple of really good players and the rest…is solid. Not enough for a championship I think.
"Rock and Roll angels bring that HardRock Hallelujah"
Alright, thank you for explaining. You’ve just made an excellent point.
"Age ain't nothing but a number!" - Reggie Miller after a Dice block
by Bakkie009 on Aug 25, 2010 3:38 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions
to me, the biggest problem with USA will be their inability to guard pick and roll basketball. coach K stinks at teaching it. these guys also give up the back door left and right. they may be better off mixing in a bunch of 2-3 zone.
i think they have plenty of guys who can stroke the 3 from international distance (durant, gay, gordon, granger, curry, westbrook, billups), but how many of them will play when the time comes? in short, i am questioning the coaching….a lot. they will go as far as kevin durant can lug them.
i do agree that greece has a serious chance, but their best match-up might be against USA. i would favor ARG or ESP in a game against Greece.
this thing is wide open – and i’m not counting brazil out either. even without Nene. they aren’t a favortie, but still have guys that can play.
one thing is for sure, this should be a very fun championship to watch.
The US will play Greece tomorrow in an exhibition game online at ESPN3. Being in different brackets, they might only play again if they both reach the final. They at least won’t play each other in the preliminary rounds, but depending on their seedings could play in an earlier round as well.
It so happens that all of the main teams reviewed by Chilai are in different brackets. If they all come out with the top seed in their bracket, they wouldn’t play amongst themselves prior to the quarter-finals. Brazil starts in the same bracket as the U.S. Turkey is in Greece’s bracket, France with Spain, and Serbia with Argentina.
I hadn’t been following international play that closely, but I would think that perhaps Argentina and Greece have the easier brackets. The U.S. will have Brazil to contend with, and it wouldn’t surprise me if they come out behind Brazil in the preliminaries. Spain is in with not just France; but Canada, New Zealand and Lithuania. The others may be a notch down from Spain, but could make for a tough schedule.
Yes, Argentina got a VERY favorable bracket, and we can avoid USA and Spain until the finals if we take care of our group. The only roadblock (as i mentioned) to the finals seems to be Greece. We will see, but right now im not feeling confident.
"Rock and Roll angels bring that HardRock Hallelujah"
Thanks for the post, Chilai. You did forget Juan Carlos Navarro from Spain… dude can flat out score in international ball. And Rubio is a better defensive player than Calderon which makes up for his 20-year old mistakes, although Jose’s loss does indeed affect Spain’s depth.
"We choose to go to the moon... and do the other things, not only because they are easy, but because they are hard." - JFK
by silverandblack_davis on Aug 24, 2010 7:13 PM CDT reply actions
YEs and YES. Navarro is a monster for Spain. He is the one guy who always gets his. And I see that you understand Rubio’s strength pretty well. He is an overrated scorer. In fact, he kinda sucks at scoring. His playmaking is well known. What most people dont realize is that Rubio first made the SPanish team because of how ridicously good he is on defense. People comparing him to nash are looking the wrong way. He is very similar to Rajon Rondo to me, with less atlheticism but a bit more flair.
"Rock and Roll angels bring that HardRock Hallelujah"
I agree 100% with everything you said. Trusting Delfino to play like Manu is inviting disaster.
I don’t understand the USA team’s strategy. Going tall and uber-athletic is what they do best in international competition. Other countries simply don’t have athletic big men.
I smell death... everywhere.
Against teams that know how to take care of the ball and handle the full court pressure….Team usa defense will look really shitty. Last tournament they had Howard and Bosh (yes the same bosh, he played superb pick and roll defense) covering lots of mistakes. Now they dont have anybody. Chandler will foul out or get an injury before you can say “help defense!”. I think they will pay costly for all those gambles team usa makes on defense.
Offensively they are still a juggernaut, even if they are lacking a post scorer. But I have serious doubts about ball movement. Lots of black holes on the team, and im not sold on rose as a distributor.
"Rock and Roll angels bring that HardRock Hallelujah"
I agree here. I only saw half of the game, but it seemed like Rose was constantly getting beat by his man (mostly Rubio) and forcing bad shots on O. Then he hits a couple of shots down the stretch and suddenly the press is calling him the game MVP. After ‘04 team US became obsessed with not getting caught without capable shooters, unfortunately they’ve now gone too far. Billups doesn’t seem like he’s going to be much like was Kidd in Beijing.
Odom will play the Bosh role and should handle it well, at least defensively. I recall him playing decent defense at the Olympics in Greece.
agree with you on Rose, but not so much on Odom. I haven’t been so impressed with him so far this time (seems to me that the ESPNers are giving him the same credit as Rose).
US did hit several tough contested shots down the stretch against Spain. Very reasonable t think that kind of offense won’t last forever.
I don’t understand the USA team’s strategy. Going tall and uber-athletic is what they do best in international competition. Other countries simply don’t have athletic big men.
You say it like they had lots of tall super-athletic big men to choose from. When the team has to consider Tyson Chandler and Javale Mcgee (wtf?) to fill that niche, clearly they’re out of options. Who that was available do you think they should have invited instead?
almost everyone was availablem but they suffered from “Idontcareaboutmynationalteamitis”
"Rock and Roll angels bring that HardRock Hallelujah"
I think if Amare’s contract wasn’t so uninsurable, he would’ve played on this team.
"We choose to go to the moon... and do the other things, not only because they are easy, but because they are hard." - JFK
by silverandblack_davis on Aug 27, 2010 7:53 AM CDT up reply actions
that’s bullshit…..just an excuse made by the knicks so they could held amare from playing in the Worlds. Are telling me ALL those players have good insurance but a guy earning 100 million coouldnt get the proper one?
"Rock and Roll angels bring that HardRock Hallelujah"
Well… microfracture and eye surgeries will do that to you.
"We choose to go to the moon... and do the other things, not only because they are easy, but because they are hard." - JFK
by silverandblack_davis on Aug 29, 2010 9:42 PM CDT up reply actions
Yay Greece!! you made me look so good!! Way to go guys!!!
(still its a preparation game, I think they didnt took it seriously and a couple of guys were missing)
"Rock and Roll angels bring that HardRock Hallelujah"
good post
I am worried USA will get knocked out also. The lack of big guys and too much gambling on defense is going to hurt the team. I am hoping we kick some ass though
One thing i can do...................is FINGER ROLL.
by gunnin' gervin on Aug 25, 2010 9:41 PM CDT up reply actions
The fallout of the brawl against Serbia was a big factor, and their main bigs didn’t play.
"We choose to go to the moon... and do the other things, not only because they are easy, but because they are hard." - JFK
by silverandblack_davis on Aug 27, 2010 7:54 AM CDT up reply actions
For what it’s worth: Rick Barry’s wife doesn’t like what you’re implying about Kammerichs.
I’m trying to rediscover verbosity. - LatinD
by J.R. Wilco on Aug 27, 2010 3:13 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
are you saying that Rick Barry tried some “asado” (wink wink) ?
"Rock and Roll angels bring that HardRock Hallelujah"
maybe his wife was the one that tried argentinean meat….just sayin
"Rock and Roll angels bring that HardRock Hallelujah"
Fair enough, but wouldn’t he have grown up in the states under those circumstances?
And he wouldn’t have been so long lost either, eh?
I’m trying to rediscover verbosity. - LatinD
maybe he is just a legitimate son of Rick Barry and his wife, and they just send him down here so he could train in the arts of being argentine. Maybe Kammerichs will get to the nba and unleash his rage soon, while his proud dad smiles from the sidelines.
"Rock and Roll angels bring that HardRock Hallelujah"
As for the other nations, they all have BIG flaws… France (shooting,surrendering)
rotflmao
Hey, if posting a sharp, insightful, yet non-sarcastic comment were that easy, even olf would do it.
by freshtunarightofftheboat on Sep 8, 2010 1:53 PM CDT reply actions
So basically Im looking really dumb now. Greece is out early (altough they lost to Spain, no shame in there), and Turkey is looking like a favorite right now (alongside USA).
"Rock and Roll angels bring that HardRock Hallelujah"

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