PtR Conference Rankings, Part 2: Western Conference
by Tim C. on Aug 1, 2010 12:50 PM CDT
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UGH. Will somebody please beat these guys?
via live.drjays.com
Last weekend, I made a feeble attempt at ranking the Eastern Conference for the 2010-11 season. And while all the dominoes have yet to fall into place, I think enough moves have been made to sufficiently rank the West as well. Follow me beyond the jump for pain and sorrow.
Playoff Teams
1. Los Angeles Lakers
Key Losses: Jordan Farmer
Key Additions: Steve Blake, Matt Barnes
I feel no need to defend this team's position at the top of the list - they've pretty damn well earned it. The only thing I might question is how well Kobe's body can hold up after years of abuse, but that's never really been a problem for him, so I wouldn't expect it to be now. The evil empire has better depth than they had last year, though. FML.
2. Dallas Mavericks (tie)
Key Losses: Erick Dampier
Key Additions: Tyson Chandler, Dominique Jones
As a USF alum, I'm a Jones fan. As a Spurs fan, I fear our northern neighbors may have found their answer to George Hill, and I hate that he plays there(great pick and roll scorer, unfortunately for George). They definitely found the best defensive center they've had in a long time, if Chandler can remain healthy. Undeveloped chemistry(big mid-season trade) and horrible matchups were Dallas's undoing vs. the Spurs in 2010, and they look poised to make another strong push.
2. San Antonio Spurs (tie)
Key Losses: Roger Mason, Malik Hairston, Keith Bogans(?)
Key Additions: James Anderson, Tiago Splitter, Gary Neal
We didn't exactly lose a lot. Bogans was probably the best of the trio of wing players that have left, and I'm not so sure the Spurs aren't bringing him back. Splitter, on the other hand, is the greatest hope for an improved silver and black squad. Well, him and a fully-healthy Tony Parker. This team will probably get off to a rough start while Splitter gets acclimated to NBA play and Pop's system. Thankfully, his defense shouldn't require much adjustment, and that's where my hope for this team lies. If our defense in the paint improves, our guards and wings can play their man closer, and do a better job of challenging jumpshots. At least, that's how it works in theory.
4. Portland Trailblazers
Key Losses: Martell Webster, Juwan Howard
Key Additions: Luke Babbitt, Elliot Williams, Wes Matthews
Did this team actually get deeper? WTF. For what it's worth, a healthy Portland squad probably would have given any team in the league a run for their money last year, and (again, when healthy) they seem like the Lakers' own version of kryptonite. So, as a Spurs fan, I hope they face our old "friends" from LA in the playoffs before we do. But then we have to find a way to beat Portland, which we didn't exactly do last season. FFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUU
5. Oklahoma City Thunder
Key Losses: Nobody
Key Additions: Cole Aldrich, Daequan Cook, Mo Peterson
Some people are putting these guys at #2 in the West. I made that mistake with Portland last year, and am not about to repeat it with OKC. However, they look like a better team on paper than they were last year. And if they bring 2010 draft pick Tibor Pleiss over from Germany(great defensive big man), they could be downright scary. Cook is kind of a head-scratcher for me, though - Thabo and Harden seem to have the SG position locked down, and and Peterson or Green probably take over SF duties when Durant isn't in the game, since Cook is undersized for that spot.
6. Denver Nuggets
Key Losses: Nobody
Key Additions: Al Harrington, Shelden Williams
This depends a lot on the team's mental state. They faltered towards the end of last season, and I don't know whether that was because they didn't have George Karl there, or if the Nuggets(as they are wont to do) simply wilted in the face of adversity. If Melo doesn't get his max extension before the start of the season, I could see that becoming a gigantic distraction to a team that's already fragile, and they could even miss the playoffs altogether. For now, I'll have more faith in Karl, and keep them in the race.
7. Houston Rockets
Key Losses: Hilton Armstrong, David Andersen
Key Additions: Patrick Patterson, Brad Miller
A healthy(ish) Yao, along with Miller and Patterson should give this team the frontcourt depth needed to make the playoffs. Hell, even without a healthy Yao they've got a pretty damn good frontcourt. Add in all the firepower they have at the guard positions, along with their two headed defensive SF brigade, and this team will not be easy to beat. The West is still pretty damn tough.
8. Utah Jazz
Key Losses: Carlos Boozer, Kyle Korver, Ronnie Brewer, Wes Matthews
Key Additions: Al Jefferson, Raja Bell, Gordon Hayward
I find Jefferson to be vastly overrated, but Sloan and Bell are a match made in basketball heaven. This team swept us in regular season play last year, and they'll still be very difficult to match up with. After watching a couple of their summer league games, I can say that Hayward's an underrated, smart defender as well. Even though I don't think they've done enough to replace what they lost, they should still be a playoff-caliber team.
___________________________________________
Early Vacationers
9. Phoenix Suns
Key Losses: Amar'e Stoudemire, Lenadro Barbosa, Louis Amundson(?)
Key Additions: Hakim Warrick, Hedo Turkoglu, Josh Childress
This was tough. I didn't want to count Phoenix out after what they did last season, and I think Gentry is a great coach, but the Suns are going to have massive problems defending the interior, especially if they use Hedo as a 4, as has been suggested. Re-signing Amundson should have been a priority, too, and if they don't act quickly, I'd love to see the Spurs add him. As great as their team chemistry was last year, I have my doubts as to whether the role players will be able to do enough to keep this team in the playoff picture. I also think age might finally catch up to Nash and Grant Hill, despite the great medical staff they have.
10. Los Angeles clippers
Key Losses: Travis Outlaw, Steve Blake, Drew Gooden
Key Additions: Eric Bledsoe, Al-Farouq Aminu, Randy Foye, Ryan Gomes, Blake Griffin*
Griffin is a beast, despite being hurt last year. Even more of a beast than DeJuan Blair. This team has enough talent to make a push for the playoffs, but bad chemistry(high offseason roster turnover) will sink them, IMO. Also, Sterling has to be bad karma, no matter how much talent is on that roster.
11. Sacramento Kings
Key Losses: Andres Nocioni, Spencer Hawes
Key Additions: Samuel Dalembert, DeMarcus Cousins, Pooh Jeter
This team is going to be really, really good in a few years if they can keep it together. That frontcourt rotation looks amazing. Evans, Casspi, Greene and even Beno can score in bunches. If they can learn to play defense, they could easily jump up into the playoff conversation. But I'm thinking they won't. Not yet, anyway. We'll see. It's a little weird that they haven't signed Hassan Whiteside yet, but he could be a valuable role player for them.
12. Memphis Grizzlies
Key Losses: Ronnie Brewer
Key Additions: Tony Allen, Xavier Henry, Greivis Vasquez
It's worth noting that Memphis has signed precisely zero of their 2010 draft picks, and they're currently in a staring contest with Henry over a whopping $300K. Meanwhile, nobody's said a damn thing about why Vasquez hasn't been signed yet, but as a first rounder, he's guaranteed to get one. If the Grizz are going to extremes to keep money away from the best shooter in the 2010 draft class(apologies to our own James Anderson, but it's true), then Rudy Gay's contract makes absolutely zero sense. Congratulations, Chris Wallace - you're creating tension on an already volatile squad.
13. New Orleans Hornets
Key Losses: Mo Peterson
Key Additions: Craig Brackins, Quincy Pondexter
I realize that this may be a surprisingly low spot for the NOOCH, but it's worth noting that their best wing player is Marcus Thornton. Well, Pondexter may surprise, but we'll wait and see on that one. Honestly, outside of Chris Paul(who wants out, no matter what's said publicly) and David West, this team is pretty bad. Other teams in the West have gotten better, but the NOOCH have been slowly eroding away. It should also be noted that West has a player option after this season, and since it pays less money than he currently makes, it's almost a certainty that he opts out. Dell Demps has a big challenge in front of him.
14. Golden State Warriors
Key Losses: Corey Maggette, Anthony Morrow, Kelenna Azubuike, Anthony Randoph, Ronny Turiaf, Anthony Tolliver(?)
Key Additions: David Lee, Epke Udoh, Dan Gadzuric, Charlie Bell, Dorrell Wright, Jeremy Lin
Luckily for the Dubs' front office, the fans are probably going to go easy on them this year after the big ownership change. Theoretically, they should finally have some defense on the perimeter with Wright and even Bell. But these guys lost a lot of offensive punch, and Udoh is already injured. I hope these guys prove me wrong, but I just don't see much hope for them to do better than last season.
15. Minnesota Timberwolves
Key Losses: Al Jefferson, Ramon Sessions, Ryan Gomes, Damien Wilkins
Key Additions: Luke Ridnour, Nikola Pekovic, Wesley Johnson, Kosta Koufos, Martell Webster
KAAAAHHHHNNNNN! Apologies to T-wolves fans, but the moves made this summer don't look like enough to get the league's worst team(again, NJ was better than that terrible record) last year out of the cellar. Johnson looked like a bust in summer league, and Ridnour might do better than Sessions in the triangle, but I doubt it will be significant enough.
__________________________________
So there it is. Now tell me how stupid I am in the comments.
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Kings have the most potential out of the non playoff teams in these rankings.
Rim Rockin' Red Rocket -silverandblack_davis
I think Memphis does
I like their talent pool better than Sac-town’s. They may not have a superstar (or two) to groom like Evans and/or Cousins, but Memphis is a much better “team” from top to bottom. But chemistry does make a difference, and all of this drama may doom them again.
I’m sad because Memphis is my #3 favorite team, merely because of proximity to my hometown (and they have cooler jerseys and team name than OKC does).
I think I’d argue that OKC is more of a sure thing than Portland due to their injuries and lack of playing time together. Although it really is a toss up.
I have a hard time not seeing the Suns make it. They should still do well in the regular season because running teams like them do well then.
I think Houston is a mixed bag because you don’t know what to expect from Yao. I Think between Suns, Rockets and Jazz, it is pretty much a toss up. Heck, Denver I’d throw into the uncertain list as they seem to be falling apart the longer Karl is away.
Tim Tim Tim….tsk tsk (YOU LIVE HEAR MAN!). I think you jinxed your selves last year when you left us out. putting the wariors ahead of PHX. then you get swept by the suns…there maybe a connection? but I don’t think your in the minority on this one. although I’m in charge of protecting the paintings of nash and hill, so they’ll be fine. the west is stacked again and again the question is…can anyone beat the lakers. but just for leaving us out i predict dragic drops 23 points in the 4th qtr in spurs suns first game….didi i mention i love that guy
"I’ve been in the league 14 years and I don’t think I’ve been called for a carry yet. It’s news to me," "I’ve never heard anyone complain about me carrying the ball. The best coach in the league Gregg Popovich didn’t have a problem with it last week."
I’m in charge of protecting the paintings of nash and hill, so they’ll be fine.
Loved this line. I hear what you’re saying… and like I said, it was tough. But more and more holes seem to be opening up on the squad, and Nash is going to have to run harder than ever to make this roster work. I’m just not sure his body can handle it much longer.
Tony apologist since 2010.
yea I don’t love getting 1,247 forwards to replace ’ but fropez is turning into something special. and thanks to my homer senses I would even say elite big man. you just never know with Nash, remember when boris diaw was the MIP, remember shawn marion. BTW i cannot believe no one has jumped on lou amundson
"I’ve been in the league 14 years and I don’t think I’ve been called for a carry yet. It’s news to me," "I’ve never heard anyone complain about me carrying the ball. The best coach in the league Gregg Popovich didn’t have a problem with it last week."
Seriously. I am wondering the same thing. Why hasn’t anyone jumped on Amundson!? In fact, he might even be an upgrade over Blair :P
Depends what Blair shows this season. But if Pop is not going to have the confidence to play Blair in the postseason becoz of matchup issues regarding the height and defence, then he should consider Amundson.
I think the first 2 mil would get him. Miami could use him he’d fill holes for Utah. guys who play that hard don’t come around that much…then again he can’t shoot to save his life.
"I’ve been in the league 14 years and I don’t think I’ve been called for a carry yet. It’s news to me," "I’ve never heard anyone complain about me carrying the ball. The best coach in the league Gregg Popovich didn’t have a problem with it last week."
TWSS?…educate me
"I’ve been in the league 14 years and I don’t think I’ve been called for a carry yet. It’s news to me," "I’ve never heard anyone complain about me carrying the ball. The best coach in the league Gregg Popovich didn’t have a problem with it last week."
that’s good old luo…play’n hard and fill’n holes
"I’ve been in the league 14 years and I don’t think I’ve been called for a carry yet. It’s news to me," "I’ve never heard anyone complain about me carrying the ball. The best coach in the league Gregg Popovich didn’t have a problem with it last week."
He played well enough against the Spurs in the Suns sweep that I’d kinda like to see him in the Silver and Black.
But… two undersized and hungry energy guys on the bench? May not be enough minutes available to utilize both effectively. And I’d certainly wouldn’t want critics to start thinking that the Spurs were on a youth kick and stop calling us “old and tired” anymore!
by freshtunarightofftheboat on Aug 3, 2010 11:29 PM CDT up reply actions
although I’m in charge of protecting the paintings of nash and hill
That is freaking hilarious. For those who have no idea what that means
Honestly, I like Tim’s rankings, but if I had to pick one possible surprise it would be the Suns. On paper they don’t make it, but I really like Gentry as a coach and Nash as a general, and their chemistry is probably going to be awesome.
Lauri: thank goodness I have you magnificent bastards to waste [the offseason] with.
I agree with who gets into the playoffs but I would change the order.
1. Lakers
2. Spurs
3. Jazz
4. Maveriks
5. Thunder
6. Trailblazers
7. Nuggets
8. Rockets(If Yao at least halfway healthy)
"Keeping the dream alive for 2011!"
after the Lakers...
it’s a crapshoot on where any team is going to end up. It’s almost easier to put SA, DAL, OKC, POR, HOU, DEN, UT, and PHX into a hat and draw to find out where they’ll end up. And that’s not counting if we get a surprise team like LAC, NO, or MEM.
I foresee chemistry problems for Dallas.
One thing about their GM is that he’s never really built a team that is greater than the sum of its parts. I thought they did well to draft two nice slashers in Dominique Jones and Beaubois the year before, but then Donnie Nelson goes ahead and acquires two centers who clog the lane.
Unless they go small, and put Dirk at the 5, I don’t see how those pieces work together. And they can’t go small against most teams in the West without being dominated in the paint. They’ll win their fair share of games because there’s a lot of talent on that team, but I don’t think they’re one of the better teams in the West.
I’m not too keen on Portland either. It’s smart to surround your stars with good role players, but their coach is so heavy handed a lot of those guys wind up with confidence issues. Come playoff time, when you know opponents will concentrate on your stars, what happens? Their role players are taken out of their comfort zone, and they can’t step up, because all season long they’ve been conditioned to defer to their stars instead of making plays. The team has a lot of fake chemistry—it’s not really a team, it’s 2 stars and 13 interchangeable parts. OKC is starting to fall into this trap.
Another thing about Portland: their stars are not two-way players. that makes them poor role models for all that young talent. that’s terrible leadership and a recipe for disaster. At least Durant, Green, and Westbrook are serious about getting better and show a tremendous work ethic.
On the other end of the spectrum is Phoenix. I love how positive Gentry is. And they are beginning to take pride in their defense. I really like their confidence and cohesiveness, and I think they’re championship contenders.
I think talent and depth will help you win a lot of games in the regular season. But I think versatility is the key to going deep in the playoffs. So, while I believe teams like the Mavs and Blazers will win more games than Suns, I don’t see them succeeding in the post-season.
my rankings reflect how they’ll be seeded for the playoffs, but the teams marked with asterisks are the teams I feel are equipped to contend for a title:
1. Lakers*
2. Nuggets
3. Blazers
4. OKC
5. Spurs*
6. Mavs
7. Suns*
8. Utah*/Rockets*
"I've hacked into your brain. You're throwing a party and no one's showing up."
ignign, interesting analysis. I like your thoughts around Dallas (the sum of the parts argument) and Portland (heavy-handed coaching produces players with no confidence) but wonder about the asterisk you put next to Houston. Can you explain why you think the Rockets will be a tough out should they make the postseason?
I always knew someday I was going to go viral - Paul "Double Rainbow" Vasquez
I’m not sure what ignign is going to write, but his asterisks correspond to the 5 teams who probably have the best coaches in the West. It could just be a coincidence though….
Jackson, Pop, Gentry (continues to impress and the team has really bought in), Sloan, and Adelman….pretty elite list…might be giving Gentry too much credit though right now
I hadn't really considered that.
Indirectly, I guess it does have to do with coaching, but also management. I think these teams have made the best of what they have. They have great coaches, and they have for the most part acquired and/or developed the best players for their systems. All of their pieces work well together. Other teams may have more talent, but these teams are greater than the sum of their parts.
"I've hacked into your brain. You're throwing a party and no one's showing up."
good chemistry, imho
the Rockets made the correct offseason acquistion: Brad Miller. Not the sexiest free agent, but a great fit for Houston.
He doesn’t clog the lane, and his familiarity with Adelman’s offense and ability to hit cutters with precision passing will accomplish two things. First, he pulls a big man out of the paint and opens up driving lanes for Kevin Martin, Aaron Brooks, and Kyle Lowry. Tangentially, teams will need to send an extra defender to impede their drives to the basket, which creates drive and kick opportunities. Even if their penetrators can’t finish at the rim, the extra attention they demand will scramble defenses, making it difficult to box out, which leads to more 2nd chance opportunities and high percentage looks.
Second, the Rockets won’t have to depend on Ariza to be some kind of dynamic wing scorer. By putting the ball in Miller’s hands at the high post, he’s going to give more role players high percentage looks off the cut. So, the Rockets should be a more efficient team next year.
I think they have enough depth now to survive regular season injuries.
They remain a proud, tough, gritty, and fundamentally sound defensive team.
Their offense reminds me of Utah’s. It’s not so much that they resemble one another, but they’re the kind of offenses that demand a lot of attention to detail. If you’re not prepared, if you’re not able to defend as a team, if you’re not an organized unit, you’re going to get smoked.
They also remind me of the Spurs, what with a talented post player in Yao, a speedy point guard in Brooks, a dynamic Ginobili-style scorer in Kevin Martin, and an enviable duo of wing defenders/3pt shooters in Ariza/Battier. Scola, too.
I think the one obstacle in Houston’s way is that Adelman’s offense is still going to take a bit longer to totally implement, what with the injuries and new players and a lack of familiarity playing with one another. They’re a team it might take all season long to really gel, but they could peak at that right time.
"I've hacked into your brain. You're throwing a party and no one's showing up."
minor quibble
it’s really kinda stupid… but I’ll say it nonetheless… the Spurs, if they won the division, could NOT be the 5th seed. Technically, they would be the 4th seed, but they could be “the 5th seed” by not having HCA in the first round despite winning the division.
I’m sure you knew all this.
i have been waiting for this list, so thanks Tim!
I hate them but I agree, the Lakers will be top seed again. Too much fire power, too much defense, too much height and too much Kobe clutch. I hate them but I respect them, much like Stalin’s USSR or the Roman Empire at its zenith.
Utah has some rebuilding to do, as does the Suns. I think the Suns will make the playoffs though b/c Gentry is a great coach and Nash is a great point guard – though that did not help them the year before.
Houston will fall apart when Yao is injured.
Nuggets will renew themselves with great vigor as Karl comes back and Chauncey finds himself looking over his shoulder at old age. Did they sign K-Mart?
Blazers and OKC are worrisome as very powerful young teams.
Living in Dallas, I hear about the Mavs quit a bit though Dallas is really a fair-weather fan city. They all are focused on the Cowboys right now and not the Mavs. Depending on what the Cowboys do will determine whether or not Dallas pays them any mind. With that being said, as long as Dirk is on the court, this will always be a threatening team.
My ranks:
1. Lakers**
2. Blazers*
3. Thunder*
4. Mavs
5. Spurs*
6. Nuggets
7. Jazz
8. Suns
and Ill take the * idea from ignign*kt and say these teams * have a good chance of seeing a ring if the Lakers** are not there
"Mr. Gilmore deserves to be in the Basketball Hall of Fame damnit. Highest field goal percentage EVER"
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/g/gilmoar01.html
Whiteside and David Lee
Hassan Whiteside was one of the first rookies to sign with his team— he signed a Blair-like 4-yr contract that pays him $750k next season.
Also, you don’t have David Lee as a key addition to the Warriors. Dan Gadzuric doesn’t count as a key addition, especially if Corey Maggette doesn’t count as a key loss
With a healthy Chris Paul, the Hornets won’t be worse than 10th. The rest of that team only adds 25 wins, though.
I like your picks so voted “none of the above”. I expect on or two of the ones on the outside likely will make the playoffs, but then who drops out is entirely dependent on luck and injuries. How well do Yao Ming, Blake Griffin and Greg Oden come back for injuries; or do they all go out with new ones (the luck of the Clippers)? Would the Lakers make the playoffs if they were to suffer a number of injuries like Portland last year, particularly if Kobe went out?
If the Hornets will finish as low as many expect, why not trade Chris Paul, and why do so many think he’d be so crucial for their team to have? I’m guessing rosters are far from settled.
Would the Lakers make the playoffs if they were to suffer a number of injuries like Portland last year, particularly if Kobe went out?
So is there no player whose injury would cause the Spurs to miss the playoffs? I’m betting there is at least one.
Hey if repeating as champions were that easy even the Spurs could do it.
by olf on Aug 2, 2010 9:35 AM CDT up reply actions
Disclaimer: I DO NOT wish injury on anyone just to be clear. (Don’t even like to talk/think about it much.) But I was thinking that Tim is essential, maybe not as essential as Kobe to the Lakes but close.
Hey if repeating as champions were that easy even the Spurs could do it.
by olf on Aug 2, 2010 9:42 AM CDT up reply actions
Maybe if it’s an injury that lasts for months on end. Short-term, the other guys(mostly Tony/Manu) have proven that they can usually make up for his absence.
Tony apologist since 2010.
I definitely think we could be the 8th seed without Tim. There’s a 95% chance of a first round exit though no matter who our opponent is.
The old guy?? The one that doesn’t even rate double teams anymore?? Can’t wait to see if Spiltter pans out, let them leave Tim open then.
Yeah, you bet, makes my heart stop when he goes down. As much as I love Manu and Tony, Tim is the heart of the team. We’d make the playoffs but that’s it.
Don’t think the Lakers would without Kobe tho.
Timmy D .... enough said.
Hello guys kobe just had KNEE surgery
correct me if im wrong, but last i checked kobe was one big bandage towards the end of the year and was very inconsistent (except when it came to hitting clutch shots) damn him, however the nba made light of kobes injury and the lakers and reporters are acting like this never even happened. This is why i think the lakers are done kobe was battling injury the whole season Lst yr, and w/ him getting knee surgery isnt going to be any better so i expect a dramatic drop in kobe mid season on out. hey maybe im wrong i definitely thought gasol would be injured w/all the playing he had done but the lake show has amazing luck
*****LE0NArD'0******
Hmmm, I would say the opposite, the knee surgery will probably help him if he was battling injury all last season. One thing I will never do is count Kobe out, he just keeps going and going. Like him or hate him, he has incredible intensity and work ethic.
Lauri: thank goodness I have you magnificent bastards to waste [the offseason] with.
If you put the quote back in context, I was saying that anyone (including the Spurs) might miss the playoffs depending on injuries. Portland seemed to have the worst luck in that regards last year, and it could be the only way L.A. would miss this year would be if they have that same bad luck including an injury to Kolbe.
If the Spurs were to lose any of their big 3 for a long period, others would partly make up for it but they would be on the edge for the playoffs. Two or three injuries and they’re likely out. I think the Lakers without Kolbe might still make the playoffs, but it would be tough if combined with other injuries.
I’d just like to point out that we came awful close to missing the playoffs after Bonner went down last year.
Rim Rockin' Red Rocket -silverandblack_davis
by SpursfanSteve on Aug 2, 2010 1:11 PM CDT up reply actions
would the Lakers make the playoffs w/o Kobe?
Interesting question… My feeling is the Lakers would be competitive, maybe make the low 3 seeds (6, 7, or 8) if they didn’t win the Pacific outright over the Suns. The reason being is that they would still operate the triangle, and get very effecient production from Gasol and Bynum. Imagine if they both got 20+ shots a game shooting over 55% a game? Scary.
But the problem is… late game situations. As a Lakers fan, this is a major reason why I am so upset over Jordan Farmar leaving. In late game situations (or late in the shot clock situations), you need a player who can dribble penetrate off either an iso set or a P&R. Now that Farmar is gone, the only player the Lakers have who is fast enough, a good enough ballhandler, and a great finisher at the hoop is the one and only Kobe Bryant. If he’s injured, who the hell is going to do that now? If you need a reference, just look at LA’s loss to Boston during the last regular season at the end of regulation. No Kobe? Not much of a chance.
Just as bad is the issue that if Kobe’s out, who’s gonna keep a lid on Artest’s crazy?
He just has to stay healthy this year for you guys to have your shot at a threepeat. End of story.
I always knew someday I was going to go viral - Paul "Double Rainbow" Vasquez
I actually agree with most of your playoff picks, in fact you made me rethink mine. I would, however, swap around some of the lower seeds. I would at least move Memphis up a spot or two.
On a side note, why no love for Yawn? ;)
Dallas: Key Additions: Tyson Chandler, Dominique Jones
San Antonio: Key Losses: Roger Mason, Malik Hairston, Keith Bogans(?)
This is the more realistic Rankings I think
Many People think that Thunder is in number 2 and the Spurs are Number 8 WTF with that
About Lakers Steve Blake its not a great defender i think, so the Point guard position still the “talon de aquiles” of the lakers i guess
Matt barnes is an agressive defender BUT he has no offensive game. They are going to miss shanon brown…..
I like the houston rockets but i dont like kevin martin
The Denver Nuggets looks fine but They need more defense i Think
I vote for new orleands because i think thay still have a good team, chris paul was injury the last season
Utah swept us last year too :^(
"Batum must be french for: being at the right place at the right time" -
-StudMuffin15 @ Rufus On Fire
"Juwan "The Clipper Killer" Howard" - Natedog1977 @ ClipsNation
" I would trade our entire team for Brandon Roy"
- Slick4President @ Indy Cornrows
by FiveOhThree-RipCity!! on Aug 1, 2010 7:06 PM CDT reply actions
The Lakers are the best team, no doubt about it, and they added depth to their bench ao they are going to be better next year
I think that Spurs, Jazz, Thunder, Nuggets and the Mavs have the same chance to finish second behind the Lakers
The Suns, Blazers and Rockets are going to be fighting for the final 2 spots.
"He was just a young skinny guy who looked like a winner. We didn’t know he was going to be as good as he is."
—Popovich on Manu Ginobili
This is a very good poll, because indeed the most intriguing question in the west is who will be #9 and barely miss the playoffs. Everyone knows who is going to be #1 though.
Here are my predictions. The Lakers are going to the Finals again unless OKC can surprise everyone. The Spurs continue their first-round match ups with Dallas.
1. Lakers *
2. OKC
2. OKC*
3. Dallas
4. Utah
5. Denver
6. Spurs
7. Phoenix
8. Portland
"We lost so many games that we shouldn't have lost," - Ginobili, May 2010
OKC has lots of potential
byt last year they were unknowns this year opponetes will be gunning for them. I say it’ll much harder for them to get to 50 wins.
"I’ve been in the league 14 years and I don’t think I’ve been called for a carry yet. It’s news to me," "I’ve never heard anyone complain about me carrying the ball. The best coach in the league Gregg Popovich didn’t have a problem with it last week."
Last season the west’s ##2-8 were very close, and I expect similar balance of power for the next season as well, with at least ##2-6 on my list being very close. I give a slight edge to OKC because they have Kevin Durant. Tiago Splitter is not bad to have, but he is not Durant. Still, the Spurs may be #2 and OKC #6, we’ll see.
"We lost so many games that we shouldn't have lost," - Ginobili, May 2010
A healthy Portland will do better than that
Thank you very much!
"Batum must be french for: being at the right place at the right time" -
-StudMuffin15 @ Rufus On Fire
"Juwan "The Clipper Killer" Howard" - Natedog1977 @ ClipsNation
" I would trade our entire team for Brandon Roy"
- Slick4President @ Indy Cornrows
by FiveOhThree-RipCity!! on Aug 1, 2010 9:12 PM CDT up reply actions
“a healthy Portland” is an oxymoron. Portland had a chance to be great for a decade, but they drafted a wrong guy with their #1 pick. still a good team, just not good enough to be a contender.
"We lost so many games that we shouldn't have lost," - Ginobili, May 2010
As currently constructed, I agree.
If Greg can manage to put together a healthy season that may be enough. All we(Blazer fans) can do is be optimistic about him at this point, cause it cant get any worse, just better.
"Batum must be french for: being at the right place at the right time" -
-StudMuffin15 @ Rufus On Fire
"Juwan "The Clipper Killer" Howard" - Natedog1977 @ ClipsNation
" I would trade our entire team for Brandon Roy"
- Slick4President @ Indy Cornrows
by FiveOhThree-RipCity!! on Aug 1, 2010 11:31 PM CDT up reply actions
Oden is a decent player, but but he is just old. He looks as old as Shaq or older. No wonder he is so fragile when playing young men game. Hopefully, he can reverse the clock. He seems to be a nice guy.
"We lost so many games that we shouldn't have lost," - Ginobili, May 2010
personally
I would save him. I wouldn’t start playing him till January, and maybe even not till the All-Star break. Save him for the playoffs, because that’s when having a 3rd decent big man will help against LA.
that’s a good idea. even better is to play him during playoffs only.
"We lost so many games that we shouldn't have lost," - Ginobili, May 2010
Why start him then? Keep him on the bench in case Portland makes the Finals.
I always knew someday I was going to go viral - Paul "Double Rainbow" Vasquez
by J.R. Wilco on Aug 5, 2010 1:58 AM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
Is there much likelihood of some international players that could make an impact signing with NBA teams after the FIBA World Championships, or would they already have signed (like Tiago)? Besides Tiago playing for the Brazil Team, I see that Nando De Colo will be playing for the French team and Robertas Javtokas for Lithuania. It seems many NBA teams are holding the rights to unsigned international players, and I imagine there are number of players that would be considered free agents to the NBA (once foreign contracts are taken care of). Back when many of us were thinking Louis Scola would become our 2nd Argentinian, Fabricio seemed to come out of the blue. Since we’ve sent Malik to Montepaschi Siena, maybe they’ll send back Kšyštof Lavrinovič, Robertas’ Lithuanian teammate?
I’m amazed that you were able to spell his name right.
"We choose to go to the moon... and do the other things, not only because they are easy, but because they are hard." - JFK
by silverandblack_davis on Aug 2, 2010 7:43 PM CDT up reply actions
Just wanted to post Tyreke Evans’ speeding video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hbwlcXlsU6s&feature=topvideos
Biggest coach Pop/Tiago Splitter homer on the internet™
by Josh Guyer (completely deck) on Aug 1, 2010 9:49 PM CDT reply actions
Here’s how I see the West:
1. Lakers
2. Non-contender, Waste of my Time.
3. Non-contender, Waste of my Time.
4. Spurs, because we don’t take the regular season seriously.
5. Non-contender, Waste of my Time.
6. Non-contender, Waste of my Time.
7. Non-contender, Waste of my Time.
8. Non-contender, Waste of my Time.
"GINOBILI!" -- Sir Charles
"I mean, Dartmouth really sucks and Cornell only beat us by 18. Temple will beat the hell out of Cornell. Promise." -- Me
Follow me on Twitter @DartFred
I have learned to stay humble.
- It is a lo-o-ong season; most anything can happen
- Health is obviously key and largely out of one’s control
- Even though they lost in 2008, the Lakes have still played in the NBA finals three straight years. Lot’s of wear & tear.
- Now that Artest has a ring I think the possibility that he or others (Lamar) lose some focus is actually higher this year than last.
- At some point, in some year somebody will knock them out.
I would hate to be the team having to face them if they are healthy but it is still a gamble. Which is why I try not to get my hopes up too high.
Having said all that if they could somehow make it out of the west again and then beat the Miami Juggernaut, that would be frickin’ epic.
Hey if repeating as champions were that easy even the Spurs could do it.
Unfortunately, I might have to root for the Lakers if the Miami Cheat are playign them in the Finals. Still undecided which team I dislike more, though.
Tony apologist since 2010.
That would be a damned shame if it happens again. Please, if the Spurs aren’t in the Finals give me at least one team I can root for, like OKC.
Timmy D .... enough said.
god no
If the Spurs can’t make the Finals, you’re options are… Super Friends dynasty for the next 8 years, or a few more Lakers titles before the SuperFriends take over (or break up). LA is the only team from the West than can beat Miami for the next 2-3 years. They have the matchups in their favor.
I think I’d root for the Lakers in that scenario, unless the Heat prove legitimately charismatic during the season.
The Heat
all the way! Kobe would have two more rings than Tim if they win. Plus I think the Heat will be and entertaining team this year.
One thing i can do...................is FINGER ROLL.
by gunnin' gervin on Aug 2, 2010 9:23 PM CDT up reply actions
if you mean by dancing on the sidelines...
playing to the crowd, going for highlight plays, doing pre-tip off staged routines and pretty much acting like a egotistical assholes…. then yeah, Miami will be all that and more.
LOL!
here we go again. Look you might not like the guys on the team but they are going to be a good team barring injury. If the coach is smart they will be a running team with a decent defense that causes a decent amount of turnovers.
One thing i can do...................is FINGER ROLL.
by gunnin' gervin on Aug 6, 2010 2:52 PM CDT up reply actions
Ugh. No Finals-watching for me, then, and I thought THIS year’s was almost intolerable.
by DrumsInTheDeep on Aug 2, 2010 1:10 PM CDT up reply actions
If the Lakers are going to make serious noise in April again, Kobe Bryant should NOT be playing thirty-eight to thirty-nine minutes per during the 82-game stretch.
As competitive as the man may be, a fourteen year career, 1,894 games, knee drains and arthritic fingers are all the reasons Jax needs to sit Kobe on the book-end of back-to-backs and keep him under thirty-three.
↓↘→ ↓↘→ ↓↘→ + P
by transgojobot on Aug 2, 2010 12:46 PM CDT up reply actions
i think it’s an approximation with slight exaggeration. 10+seasons of 82 regular season games, +playoffs, + international ball, the number is easily close to 1300.
Rim Rockin' Red Rocket -silverandblack_davis
by SpursfanSteve on Aug 2, 2010 5:09 PM CDT up reply actions
Kobe minutes aren’t like Manu minutes. Kobe knows how to coast and pick his moments. A lot of the time during a lot of the games he’s not going all out and thus not suffering nearly as much wear and tear.
by doggydogworld on Aug 2, 2010 9:34 PM CDT up reply actions
also true.
Rim Rockin' Red Rocket -silverandblack_davis
by SpursfanSteve on Aug 2, 2010 10:38 PM CDT up reply actions
this is also why Kobe doesn't get as much respect on the defensive side
because he… I don’t want to say takes plays off, because he’s not Randy Moss… but he does coast, or doesn’t try as hard. Usually he only tries real hard on defense if his counterpart (the teams SG) is having a great night, or if he’s facing a superstar perimeter player that he can match up with. Remember Kobe vs. AI? That was when he was one of the fastest players in the league.
In fact, that’s probably what makes Kobe so great. He’s easily the quickest player in the league at 6’7" or taller, with the best ball handling of any player that size or bigger. Opponents must either play a fast, but smaller player against him that he’ll shoot over, or a bigger, stronger, but slower player that Kobe just blows past.
Kobe, arghh!
At least I can take consolation in the fact that his hairline’s receding.
I always knew someday I was going to go viral - Paul "Double Rainbow" Vasquez
LOL
One thing i can do...................is FINGER ROLL.
by gunnin' gervin on Aug 6, 2010 2:52 PM CDT up reply actions
I have learned to stay humble.
I always knew someday I was going to go viral - Paul "Double Rainbow" Vasquez
by J.R. Wilco on Aug 4, 2010 10:37 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
rock paper scissors
Sometimes I THINK that the basketball and the finals of the NBA are just a game rock paper scissors
Question
Why if the spurs beat the Number 2 Mavericks get swept by the phoenix suns?
Sometimes I imagine the finals between
Lakers – Magic
Lakers – Cavaliers (With LeBron)
And I think that the Magic or the Cavs would win the championship.
Boston didn’t have homecourt advantage and the Magic and Cavs have a better season record and both won games agains the lakers
The West will have really fallen off is the Lakers are the top seeded team in the conference for the 3rd straight year. Somebody out there needs to put together a better regular season than them.
Hmm lots of people seem to think Houston and Utah are 7 and 8 in some order.
That doesn’t seem right to me I put them in the second tier group with OKC and San Antonio. Chances are one of them ends up in the top half of the playoff bracket and the other goes in the bottom half. TWSS
To put it in rankings:
1. LA
2. Mavs
3. OKC
4. Spurs
5. Utah
6. Rockets
7. Denver
8. Portland
The Mavs are a good regular season team because of their depth. OKC could have that kind of depth this year too. I do think the Northwest division is in for a bit of an off-year and Utah is the best team there.
I’m with you on Utah, but not Houston yet. I think OKC is overrated. Utah and Portland are both better to me.
Don’t take this personally, BlaseE, I’m just curious…
Why do some folks here think Utah is actually better than they were last year?
Tony apologist since 2010.
Last year, they had a lot of injuries. I think Al Jefferson is good. I think Deron Williams will make him and everyone else better like always. Hayward was a good draft pick who can probably contribute some now. Raja Bell is a good pick up. Jerry Sloan is probably a consensus top 3-5 coach in the NBA. It’s like you said. I think they will be better. It’s just the impression I get looking at their team. To be fair, I only watched some of their playoff games and their games against us which might give an exaggerated view on how good they were last year.
I don’t think they are a contender, but I don’t think anyone in the NW is despite probably being the best division top to bottom. Spurs, Dallas, or Lakers are coming out of the West like your rankings have it.
I agree, Utah is going to be pretty good. I dont think the are going to miss Boozer at all. Jefferson is already a pretty good player, and I expect him to put Amare like numbers now that he’s playing with Williams, and Sloan is going to force him to play defense.
"He was just a young skinny guy who looked like a winner. We didn’t know he was going to be as good as he is."
—Popovich on Manu Ginobili
Boozer
will be missed deeply. He can shot jumpers ten times better than Al Jefferson and that is one of the big things that made Boozer such a good scorer. Even though he was kind of short for his position he could take the taller slower bigs on the wing and they had to respect his jumper. Jefferson is a post up player with a lot of good moves but he makes a boat load of them and he also isn’t as good passing out the double team as Boozer. Jefferson and Boozer are two totally different animals and it is going to take a bit for Williams to gel with that guy. No more pick and pops like they could do with Boozer. Not to mention there wing play isn’t going to be as good with out Wesley Matthews.
One thing i can do...................is FINGER ROLL.
by gunnin' gervin on Aug 2, 2010 9:28 PM CDT up reply actions
I am off today. LOL. I was trying to say Al Jefferson is more methodical in the paint and takes a boat load of time with various different moves before shooting.
One thing i can do...................is FINGER ROLL.
by gunnin' gervin on Aug 2, 2010 10:59 PM CDT up reply actions
my question is outside shooting
Boozer is replaced by Jefferson. Al is better in the post, IMO, but much worse defensively. I have no idea how he’ll play in the P&R, I never saw that play run once in the few Minny games I watched.
Matthews is replaced by Bell. This is merely a role player position, bringing defense and some outside shooting. I have more confidence in Bell to make an outside shot than Wesley, but we’re talking 15-20 minutes a game. Not going to make a huge difference.
Korver is replaced by….? For those that didn’t know, Kyle Korver just set the NBA 3 Point Shooting Percentage for a season at FIFTY THREE PERCENT!!!!!!! (53.6% to be exact). Granted, he only took a little over 100 3s last season, and is a career 41% outside shooter, but that’s someone that can’t be replaced easily. Just for some perspective, Chicago was in a free for all over finding a great outside shooter after getting Boozer. Korver was the perfect fit for them if they weren’t going to get Reddick. All of the talent available in the past offseason, and the only players getting signed as a “shooter” were Ray Allen, Kyle Korver, and JJ Reddick. Hmm… Seems like Utah might have a problem unless they get lucky with the D-League again.
The Jazz Mavs and Spurs have been making the playoffs for so long I wouldn’t bet against them without a compelling reason.
Utah’s still a veteran team with Jerry Sloan coaching. They always play great defense and Jefferson/Millsap/AK47/Okur is a fine frontcourt if they don’t all get injured.
Portland and even the Nuggets have more questions and doubts circling em. The Jazz might not be better than last season but I do expect them to win the NW.
I really am off today because i forgot all about Millsap! The Jazz will make it to the playoffs but i think they still will miss Boozer a lot.
One thing i can do...................is FINGER ROLL.
by gunnin' gervin on Aug 2, 2010 11:02 PM CDT up reply actions
I hate to say it but I wouldn’t sleep on the Clippers playoff chances. It’s hard to say which team i would replace them with in your ranking but I wouldn’t surprise me if they end up in the playoffs.
"I've got Tim (Duncan) and you don't. That's the difference." -Gregg Popovich
+1
I think they might be able to get the 8th spot if Vinny doesn’t screw them up too bad and they stay fairly healthy.
One thing i can do...................is FINGER ROLL.
by gunnin' gervin on Aug 2, 2010 9:30 PM CDT up reply actions
I would put the Mavs towards the bottom. They had a poor efficiency differential last year and had to win a lot of close games to get their wins. That’s usually not a good sign. Also, if Chandler can’t return to form and stay healthy they’ve added nothing and lost Dampier, who was over paid but at least somewhat productive. Jones is a rookie who was an average producer in college, Yawn is unproven.
Portland could be amazing if they can get healthy, I have no idea where to put them, anywhere from 2-8. OKC could be amazing if Ibaka continues his development and Aldrich gives them anything this eyar.
1.LA
2.Spurs, OKC, Portland
3.Denver, Mavs
4.Rockets, Phoenix, Warriors, Jazz.
I don’t get why people think OKC is going to be so good.
They have a really good point guard Westbrook and a great SF in Durant. After that, Sefolosha is a defensive only player, and they ran him 100 less minutes than Duncan, but more than any other Spur. Harden is really inconsistent. Maynor is a decent backup. Mo Peterson is 32 years old and coming off his worst season of his career. He posted career lows everywhere (except turnovers, attempts, and fouls).
That brings me to their front court. They start Jeff Green, a SF, at PF with Nenad Krstic, a good back-up. They don’t have a starting PF or C. Ibaka is good, but he is inconsistent and still developing. Collison is a blue collar workhorse, but he is just adding (metaphorical) length to a shallow pool. Who gives a shit about Byron Mullens and DJ White, seriously? Aldrich may be able to contribute but not to a championship or even playoff level.
Here are some stats comparing Krstic, Collison, and Ibaka (3 players to get most minutes after Green in the front court) to Blair, Dice, and Bonner (3 players to get the most minutes after Duncan in the front court).
1539 to 1541 points
4621 to 4272 minutes
1239 to 1295 field goal attempts
So in 350 more minutes, they scored about the same as our 3 guys, all of which just got pushed down a notch on the depth chart by Splitter. Blair has as much potential to improve as Ibaka.
They will never win a chip with Jeff Green starting at PF. They need to make him Durant’s backup or trade him since he is one of their best assets. They were also the least injured team last year. They had 4 guys start all 82 games for them. Krstic started 76. I like the Thunder and I hope they are better, but this lineup is not a top tier West team.
Honestly, I’d love Green on the Spurs. We’d actually use him at the 3, and he’s perfect for a smallball 4(or as an answer to Odom) as well. Too bad Presti isn’t just going to give him to us.
Tony apologist since 2010.
Oh, and full agreement on OKC. They’ll probably be improved, but not #2 in the conference.
Tony apologist since 2010.
I actually thought your Dice for Green trade with more pieces to balance the talent of the trade was good. OKC should trade Green before they have to resign him. Durant and Westbrook are the must-keep core.
Dice probably only has one year left though and the Spurs are usually bad trade partners, but they need a player like Dice.
It seems to me that the time has come when the Spurs need a player like that for the entire season and not simply the last month or so of the season. Perhaps Dice was doing a number of little things early in the season that don’t show up in the box score, but it seemed the box scores often had zero points for him and Bogans. I figured that Pop might figure that he’d be more valuable once the playoffs arrive (and Dice himself often seemed to be saying that he was a second half of the season type of player), ala Robert Horry.
I think Tim and Manu are reaching that point in their careers where the Spurs are more concerned about keeping them ready for the playoffs than anything that happens in the regular season. But when you’ve got too many players like that you run the risk that you miss the playoffs entirely. I think I’d like to see someone who might be a young Dice at the beginning of his career rather than ol’ Dice at the end of his career.
The most critical ingredient to a Championship team is a great low post presence. Teams without one always fall short. Miami had Shaq, the Lakers had Shaq and now have the Gasol/Bynum deal, Pistons had Sheed in his prime, Celts had Garnett (who was actually dominant the year they won) and we’ve had Tim.
Jordan made everyone forget that you needed a great big man to win, (although I would argue he was the Bull’s low post threat which is why the triangle was so effective.) But before Jordan dominated the league, championship teams always relied on a big guy: Kareem, Russel, Moses, Willis Reed, Wilt, Unseld, The Dream, Walton, Mchale, and Parish, to just name a few.
So wake me when OKC finds a big man. Also, Miami will need either Lebron or Wade to develop a post game to be a contender. Standing at half court and driving 1 on 5 will not win a title.
"GINOBILI!" -- Sir Charles
"I mean, Dartmouth really sucks and Cornell only beat us by 18. Temple will beat the hell out of Cornell. Promise." -- Me
Follow me on Twitter @DartFred
If Unseld could be considered a great low post presence at 6’7", does that mean there’s hope for Dejuan, or has that era passed?
I’m working on a post that talks about just that. So you’ll have to wait, if that’s cool.
"GINOBILI!" -- Sir Charles
"I mean, Dartmouth really sucks and Cornell only beat us by 18. Temple will beat the hell out of Cornell. Promise." -- Me
Follow me on Twitter @DartFred
don’t forget the ‘Round Mound of Rebound’ … there’s plenty of hope for Blair as a short 4 in the modern era
Defense young man, Defense wins Championships! - Nevil Shed
+1
Plus the rules are more geared toward scoring with the way they call fouls on anything. When Charles and Wes were playing you had to be bleeding to get fouls called. Now if somebody looks at you wrong the refs are blowing the whistle. I truly think if he keeps working on his game he can be a decent pro like Paul Milsap
One thing i can do...................is FINGER ROLL.
by gunnin' gervin on Aug 2, 2010 11:04 PM CDT up reply actions
I think that’s selling Blair short. I think he’ll have a much better back to the basket game than Millsap.
Rim Rockin' Red Rocket -silverandblack_davis
by SpursfanSteve on Aug 3, 2010 11:49 AM CDT up reply actions
I didn’t mean he wouldn’t be as good as Millsap. I am just saying Millsap is a decent NBA player who is supposedly small for his position like Blair. Millsap is a better athlete than Blair though but I truly think if Blair gets in the gym and works on his shooting, handles, plus defensive positioning he can be a great player despite his height. The guy has a knack for getting the ball if on offense or defense. You can’t teach that stuff at all.
One thing i can do...................is FINGER ROLL.
by gunnin' gervin on Aug 3, 2010 7:57 PM CDT up reply actions
I am also looking forward to the post
One thing i can do...................is FINGER ROLL.
by gunnin' gervin on Aug 2, 2010 11:05 PM CDT up reply actions
Excellent points Fred. Also, Jordan and Pippen get so much attention that everyone forgets that the Bulls had Bill Cartwright for a few of those titles, and thought it was so critical to have a decent center that they traded Oakley to get him.
Lauri: thank goodness I have you magnificent bastards to waste [the offseason] with.
Nenad’s statistics are rather similar to those of Bill Cartwright’s during the championship years. I suppose if OKC wins it all in future years we’ll look back and talk about Nenad as a dominant big.
Before he got hurt in NJ, he looked like he was going to be at least solid starter/borderline all star material.
Rim Rockin' Red Rocket -silverandblack_davis
by SpursfanSteve on Aug 2, 2010 7:23 PM CDT up reply actions
Bulls also had Horace Grant providing size and power inside.
Lauri: thank goodness I have you magnificent bastards to waste [the offseason] with.
I agree, but save for Kobe, no guard or SF wants to learn any low post moves these days.
"We choose to go to the moon... and do the other things, not only because they are easy, but because they are hard." - JFK
by silverandblack_davis on Aug 2, 2010 8:01 PM CDT up reply actions
Sometimes it seems that Centers and PFs don’t want to learn post moves these days. In my day…
signed, crotchety old man.
Lauri: thank goodness I have you magnificent bastards to waste [the offseason] with.
He’s looking at you, Dwight Howard.
Rim Rockin' Red Rocket -silverandblack_davis
by SpursfanSteve on Aug 2, 2010 8:51 PM CDT up reply actions
That’s one, though I can excuse him as he has Ewing as a mentor. However, Howard worked out with Hakeem this summer so may become a bit more dangerous .
At least Dwight tries to play post ::cough:: Dirk ::cough::
Lauri: thank goodness I have you magnificent bastards to waste [the offseason] with.
When Dirk has someone (much) smaller on him, he’s not afraid to post. Howard standing just outside of the paint near the rim waiting for a rebound doesnt exactly qualify as “playing the post”
Rim Rockin' Red Rocket -silverandblack_davis
by SpursfanSteve on Aug 2, 2010 10:41 PM CDT up reply actions
True that (about Howard). But if Dirk learned some decent post moves and used them against big guys as well he would raise his game another notch.
Lauri: thank goodness I have you magnificent bastards to waste [the offseason] with.
I think that I see that Howard wants to be more effective scoring in the post, but he just doesn’t know how.
If he really did work out with Hakeem this past season, look for him to improve dramatically.
If he doesn’t, then we know it’s not the teacher, it’s the student — b/c Olajuwon has already shown that he can pass his knowledge on to the next generation (Kobe andYao) successfully.
I always knew someday I was going to go viral - Paul "Double Rainbow" Vasquez
Dirk
didn’t post Bowen a whole lot. I will admit he goes down there a little more now than he did in the past but he still is more prone to shoot the turnaround than to take it strong at the smaller guy. If Dirk worked on his post game he would be the most unstoppable scorer in the NBA
One thing i can do...................is FINGER ROLL.
by gunnin' gervin on Aug 2, 2010 11:07 PM CDT up reply actions
SWGEEK
Sad but so damn true with your statements
One thing i can do...................is FINGER ROLL.
by gunnin' gervin on Aug 2, 2010 9:38 PM CDT up reply actions
I would argue for Scottie to be the Bulls low post presence among the wings.
Maybe its my inner fanboy coming out. But Scottie was such a joy to watch. I miss those mid-90s.
Both Jordan and Scottie were adept post players, which really made that Bulls team so devastating.
"We choose to go to the moon... and do the other things, not only because they are easy, but because they are hard." - JFK
by silverandblack_davis on Aug 10, 2010 11:43 PM CDT up reply actions
Personally I’d like to see Tim and Manu as the only players on the roster born prior to 1980. At the moment the only other one is Dice. I’d consider an exception for one other player like Fabricio whose role would be more as a mentor/coach and did not suit up that often. Otherwise the players counted on to support Tim & Manu should be younger guys, not older.
I’d rather have someone earning $4.8million that will be due for a raise in a year or two than someone making the same and heading for retirement.
I’d consider an exception for one other player like Fabricio whose role would be more as a mentor/coach and did not suit up that often.
Hmmm… should Fab retire anytime soon, I wonder if the Spurs could/would hire him as a big man coach for the young bigs? He could give Splitter advice on adapting his game to the NBA, for example.
by freshtunarightofftheboat on Aug 3, 2010 11:41 PM CDT up reply actions
Honestly, I’d love Green on the Spurs.
I would too. But his availability might depend on what shape the new CBA takes.
After Kevin Durant’s extension kicks in, Sam Presti is going to have one helluva a juggling act on his hands. He’ll have to worry about Jeff Green and Russell Westbrook’s impending RFA status in back-to-back summers. Then, James Harden’s after that.
If the owners get their way, we’ll be seeing a vastly different free-agency landscape in the future. But there’s no real way to know if that will favor the Spurs or not.
↓↘→ ↓↘→ ↓↘→ + P
by transgojobot on Aug 2, 2010 12:55 PM CDT up reply actions
Well, here’s another way to look at it. Last year as an extremely young team who won 50 games and played the Lakers reasonably well. They had the ninth best efficiency differential in the NBA, 4th in the West.
They lost no one and filled a big need in the draft. You say Harden is inconsistent, but he’s a rookie, that’s what they do. Maynor was also a rookie and can be expted to improve. Ibaka is already very good average almost 11 rebounds, 13 pts, and 2.7 blocks per 36 combined with a solid 56 TS%. He also still has room to imrove.
So this was a solid team last year that we can expect improvement form. I don’t think it’s unreasonable for them to finish in the to half of the conference.
i do agree about green at PF. I just don’t know why you’d hold on to him. He has trade value as a SF and doesn’t fill a team need.
Second year players aren’t much better than first years. Rookies beat the Sophs last season too…..
OKC is a good team, a playoff team. I expect they will be better. I don’t expect them to be as healthy and I think their weaknesses are just as big as they were last year. Team’s also have another year of scouting on them under Brooks. I think they caught us off guard in 2008-09, but we had them last year and that was us playing regular season ball.
“Second year players aren’t much better than first years. Rookies beat the Sophs last season too…..”
I’m sorry, are you suggesting that rookies don’t generally improve? Or that it’s normally in their third or fourth year and not in their second?
I’m saying rookies improve every year (if they don’t suck to begin with…. although if they suck to begin with they have more room to improve….), but the improvement from year one to two should be negligible to a championship contender. For example, Hill was far improved this year, possibly the most improved player in the league, but our reliance on him seriously hurt us against the Suns as they exposed his still developing pick and roll defense over and over.
Similarly, I expect Blair to be better next season, but I don’t expect him to have Dice range or have all of his fouls cleaned up. This takes me back to my original argument though. Blair is in a deep rotation of bigs. Harden is their 6th man essentially. He was 4th on their team in scoring and 10th in FG% of their guys who played more than 23 games, 9th if you only count guys who played in at least 55 games. His ceiling is high but he is a weak point as the 6th man on a contender right now unless he improves dramatically next season.
This is even further exaggerated in the current state of the one and two year college players.
All I’m saying is that Harden is a rough 6th man right now. OKC needs a legitimate PF starter and Green to be their 6th man to even be considered a title contender.
As Gino20 stated, Harden was a more efficient scorer than his FG% would indicate. As a rookie SG he had a TS% of 55. He shoots the 3 decently and gets to the line and converts. He was even better against the Lakers getting up to 58% TS. He also lowered his turnover rate while maintaing his assists. A very solid performance for a rookie in his first playoff series against the defending and eventual champs.
I’m not saying that players get everything worked out in year 2, but they tend to improve. Players tend to peak around age 25 according to wagesofwins.com.
Durant – 21, Westbrook -21, Green -23, Ibaka -20, Maynor -23, Harden – 20. Getting small improvements from all these players would make OKC a much better team. Remeber they already had the number 4 efficiency differential in the West last year. Get anything from Aldrich this year and play Krstic less and watch out.
Its that part about improvement that bugs me about OKC. Some teams do improve, but rarely do they make a huge jump within the list of playoff teams based purely off improvement. The Hornets were supposed to go off and become a perennial playoff team, until injuries plagued them again, and the Blazers have suffered a similar fate.
Teams have to show me that they can get over now being on everyone’s radar. It still stands that they’ve done nothing more than get an 8th seed and win 2 games at home. I wouldn’t even count them in the playoffs as they are the weakest team without their best player (injury) out of any of the playoff teams on that list.
I agree that its not unreasonable for them to finish top half of the conference, but everything has to go right for them to get home court advantage imo.
+1
BlasE. I think OKC is a good team but there is still that second reliable scorer missing on that team. I lie Westbrook but he has to be able to knock down those jumpers more consistently. Durant is pretty much there only reliable scoring threat and then the rest of those guys are roll players. I also agree about there front court depth being thinner than Jeff Van Gundy’s hair. Jeff Green isn’t a power forward and he isn’t a small forward neither. I pretty much agree with everything BlasE stated but the beauty of this team is that they are young and Ibaka might develop into something more along with Westbrook getting a better shooting stroke.
One thing i can do...................is FINGER ROLL.
by gunnin' gervin on Aug 2, 2010 9:36 PM CDT up reply actions
I’m curious to know why Memphis got so many votes. I don’t see them as a serious threat to make the playoffs, so I’d like to know a bit more of the reasoning behind those votes. Anyone that voted that way want to tell me more?
Tony apologist since 2010.
Mostly because they had a stretch toward the end of the season where they almost pushed us out of the playoffs. If they build on that, they are a threat to make the playoffs. I doubt it happens, but the potential is there to do some damage.
Rim Rockin' Red Rocket -silverandblack_davis
by SpursfanSteve on Aug 2, 2010 5:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Maybe they should give up this season and trade the other Gasol to the Spurs. I expect they may not be that interested in Dice, who we would have to move to get cap space, but I imagine someone might be interested in exchange for some young talent to Memphis.
I didn’t vote for MEM, but I could see how one might. They have lotsa talent—M. Gasol, Z-Bo, Mayo, Gay—the pieces may or may not fit, and that could be their own undoing. They have the talent to be a “sweet dream,” but the reverse backward potential to be a “beautiful nightmare.” Or an ugly nightmare.
That’s what she (Beyonce) said.
Interesting lists. Well, here’s my predictions.
1. Los Angeles Lakers (unfortunately) :(
2. San Antonio Spurs :)
3. Oklahoma City Thunder
4. Denver Nuggets
5. Houston Rockets
6. Dallas Mavericks
7. Portland Trailblazers
8. Utah Jazz
Just missing the playoffs: 9. Memphis Grizzlies, 10. Phoenix Suns
And I did vote for Memphis, because like Gino20 said, they have lots of talent. If they played like they did toward the end of the season, they could make the playoffs. But if I could only choose one team who missed the playoffs last season and make it this season, it would be Houston. That’s why I think they’re in, and Memphis is out.
Whoops, I didn’t know there was a ‘none of the above’ choice. Haha. I should have chosen that instead of Memphis, now that I think about it.
Actually, I agreed with the 8 playoff picks from Tim C., and I thought PHX would be on the outside (but with a reasonably good chance of getting in, especially if one team has serious injuries or underperforms—and this is pretty likely), but I still chose PHX instead of “nobody” b/c of the wording of the poll: “most likely to make the playoffs,” not necessarily that they will make it.
Does anyone have access to ESPN Insider? Hollinger is running a new series on Future Rankings of all the NBA teams and I’m interested to see where he has the Spurs. He hasn’t had the Top 10 yet, but he’s done 11 through the rest of the league.
Thought it would be cool to know where he believes the Spurs to be heading in comparison to the rest of the league. And since we were talking about the Power Rankings of the West for next season, why not add in what the future holds.
Well, he and Chad Ford (it’s a dual project) must have the Spurs in the top ten, because there’s no sign of them yet.
They ranked the Suns 27th. Ouch.
The Knicks are ranked 11, Sacramento 12, and Boston 13.
Mavs are 14, Nets are 15.
I’ll let you know when the Spurs show up on the list.
I have flying monkeys at my disposal, and I'm not afraid to use them.
All right, 1 through 10 have been posted. As you may have guessed, they ranked the Spurs 10. :-/
Here are the rest:
9. Denver
8. Utah
7. Orlando
6. Portland
5. Rockets
4. Bulls
3. Cowboy Thunderclusters
2. Lakers
1. Miami Superfriends
I have flying monkeys at my disposal, and I'm not afraid to use them.
They ranked the Suns 27th. Ouch.
well, losing a GM (Kerr) who orchestrated the Spur-killing machine they created last season was not a positive for them. Nor was replacing him with Turkey-Glue’s agent. Not to mention, bringing in Turkey-Glue himself.
I think they deserved to be penalized.
It’ll be interesting to see if they penalize the Spurs for re-signing Jefferson. My impression is that Hollinger felt that the restructured deal was a positive one for the Spurs, so much so that he wondered whether it had been pre-arranged (which would invite sanctions from the league office).
by freshtunarightofftheboat on Aug 3, 2010 11:47 PM CDT up reply actions
those rankings are evidently sponsored by the Apostrophe or one of his fans. I can guarantee that the Suns, Boston and Dallas all will have better record than the Knicks. If not, I’ll eat all electrons my words are written on.
"We lost so many games that we shouldn't have lost," - Ginobili, May 2010
I really want the Rockets to have a good year, but I have a bad feeling that they’re missing the playoffs again.
I have flying monkeys at my disposal, and I'm not afraid to use them.
RJ hopes he comes through too
Oh wait, the Spurs did actually give him a new contract. So RJ just hopes to make it home every night after an easy night of work.
10 votes?
For the Twolves? Kahnlovers in the house believing the PG strategy will pay off in the end…
Hilarious
That the Rockets aren’t higher. They’re deep, experienced, still young, and don’t need much from Yao other than defense.
The Dream Shake ...on Twitter.
"I think girls are probably just better shooters." - Steve Novak
Don’t get me wrong, I like the Rockets’ team, but I don’t know that I would drop any of the teams in front of them. Maybe Denver, since ’Melo might be mentally checked out already.
Tony apologist since 2010.
Denver
is kind of shaky anyway. Even if Carmelo hasn’t checked out mentally.
One thing i can do...................is FINGER ROLL.
by gunnin' gervin on Aug 9, 2010 9:26 PM CDT up reply actions
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