Wojnarowski is my hero
by Aaronstampler on Nov 30, 2010 1:27 AM CST
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PrintI LOVE WOJO.
Adrian Wojnarowski is rapidly becoming one of my favorite humans, even if he has no idea who I am. I don't know if he actually has inside sources planted inside the locker rooms of the Cavs, the Heat and Team USA, but I do know that I don't care. Even if it's fiction, it's the kind of fiction that I so badly want to be true, which is all that matters. Nobody on the planet consistently has the goods on "why LeBron is a stupid dick" as much as Wojo does. He just rocks my world so hard.
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=aw-lebronspoelstra112910
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Woj is one of my favorite bball writers too.
Hey, if posting a sharp, insightful, yet non-sarcastic comment were that easy, even olf would do it.
Mike Monroe: ...the uninformed presume Parker is expendable.
by freshtunarightofftheboat on Nov 30, 2010 1:46 AM CST reply actions
Damn, that was fun. For some reason I’m remembering the behind the scenes footage of Tim and Lebron meeting after the Spurs swept the Cavs in the Finals. Tim congratulates him on a good series and then says something along the lines of “It’s going to be your league soon” and then deadpans, “thanks for letting us have this year.” In my opinion, Tim’s humility ranks right behind his Hall of Fame talent and his good fortune of landing with the Spurs as reasons for his 4 rings and nearly 15 years of greatness. If Lebron could ever grasp that and get over himself, it really would be his league.
by Tim B. Dunkin' on Nov 30, 2010 1:49 AM CST reply actions 1 recs
If this was indeed true, then awesome:
Wade was one of the Team USA players who’d watch incredulously as James would throw a bowl of fries back at a renowned chef and bark, "They’re cold!" Or throw his sweaty practice jersey across the court and command a team administrator to go pick it up.
"A life, Jimmy, you know what that is? It’s what happens while you wait for moments that will never come." - Lester Freamon, The Wire
by silverandblack_davis on Nov 30, 2010 2:33 AM CST reply actions
I wonder, if a chef served James gazpacho soup, would the “King” send it back because it was cold?
Hey, if posting a sharp, insightful, yet non-sarcastic comment were that easy, even olf would do it.
Mike Monroe: ...the uninformed presume Parker is expendable.
by freshtunarightofftheboat on Nov 30, 2010 4:17 PM CST up reply actions
GOL!
btw I was thinking of the Red Dwarf episode in which Rimmer complained about his gazpacho being cold.
Hey, if posting a sharp, insightful, yet non-sarcastic comment were that easy, even olf would do it.
Mike Monroe: ...the uninformed presume Parker is expendable.
by freshtunarightofftheboat on Nov 30, 2010 5:33 PM CST up reply actions
If my chips were cold, I’d send them back! Goddamn, what the hell is wrong with that?
"Are you gunna bite all day little doggie, or are you gunna bite?"
by Joseph Parkes on Nov 30, 2010 5:57 PM CST up reply actions
“throw them back at a renowned chef”
Hey, if posting a sharp, insightful, yet non-sarcastic comment were that easy, even olf would do it.
Mike Monroe: ...the uninformed presume Parker is expendable.
by freshtunarightofftheboat on Nov 30, 2010 6:08 PM CST up reply actions
Woj often strikes me as a sanctimonious prick who has settled on manufacturing and regurgitating anti-LeBron sentiment as his meal ticket. This is what he has decided his great theme will be, what his legacy will be, his unique contribution to hoops history.* The same way Bill Simmons milks pop culture and arrested frat-boy humor. Woj has even started repeating himself, writing over and over about James’ supposed antics on Team USA. Such a convenient well of ever-renewable outrage, that topic, even though the conduct in question would have occurred over two years ago at this point. Woj makes it sound like James was spitting on the Declaration of Independence by winning that gold medal. **
When was the last time Woj wrote about the actual mechanics of basketball, anyway? Or even referred to them? Just, you know, wrote about the game? Seems like all he writes about are personalities, rumors, injuries, power struggles, da dee da dun da dah. Maybe that’s what he’s been told to write but somehow I doubt it. He’s like the Us Weekly of the NBA.
Or maybe that was your point. . . . In which case I look kind of dumb now, huh? Oh hey, he was being sarcastic! Yeah, I knew that . . . um . . . ::scuffing ground::
*I guess sentimental books about Bob Hurley coaching city kids who know their place don’t generate the same sort of media buzz. I bet Woj has sweet cathartic dreams in which a young LeBron magically finds himself on Hurley’s St. Anthony team. You wouldn’t catch Coach Hurley massaging that little asshole’s ego, hell no.
**Do I doubt that James is an egotistical guy with the capacity for selfish behavior? No, not at all. But I’d hardly characterize what Woj does in his incessant battering of such an easy target an example of claiming the moral high ground. If anything, Woj is more contemptible to me precisely because I can see what he’s doing. He’s got the blindfold off and he is WHALING on that pinata, and every thwack equals another million page views. The proof of Woj’s conduct and motivation is right there on the page, whereas much of the frothing at the mouth about LeBron is based on pure conjecture and schadenfreude. A question: How is Woj’s scapegoating of LeBron any less craven than the scapegoating of Spoelstra?
I have flying monkeys at my disposal, and I'm not afraid to use them.
by Lauri on Nov 30, 2010 5:18 AM CST reply actions 8 recs
thankyou for essentially writing my reply for me.
comments may be 1 minute behind reality
by sleep research facility on Nov 30, 2010 5:24 AM CST up reply actions
I got curious and decided to answer my own question. Here are the last 15 titles and teases for Woj’s columns.
King James wants Spoelstra to bow to him November 29, 2010
On the week he returns to Cleveland, LeBron James seems interested only in selling out his coach.
Riley should support coach, not replace him November 25, 2010
As Miami’s star-filled roster continues to flail under Erik Spoelstra, Pat Riley fears risking his own legacy.
Kobe still tough, with assists from the greats November 23, 2010
The Lakers star reveals how Bill Russell and even Michael Jackson have shaped his storied career.
Hurt Haslem sidelined at least until late February November 21, 2010
Heat forward Udonis Haslem has a torn ligament in his left foot and faces possible surgery.
Roy’s knee is the one that scares Blazers November 18, 2010
Losing Greg Oden for another season hurts, but it’s Brandon Roy’s status that has Portland sweating.
Heat folding under weight of season November 12, 2010
After another bad loss, the Heat say they’ll get to know each other. They might not like what they learn.
Bench duty doesn’t suit Riley – for now November 11, 2010
Pat Riley doesn’t want to return to coaching. But if the Heat struggle? The choice might not be his.
Bearup latest to leave Nuggets November 9, 2010
Bret Bearup, an adviser to owner Stan Kroenke, has been pushed out in a power struggle within the franchise.
League closing doors on Thomas’ iffy return November 8, 2010
With the NBA probing possible violations under his watch, Isiah Thomas has little chance of rejoining the Knicks.
Trust binds Hornets’ coach, GM November 5, 2010
Monty Williams and Dell Demps have leaned on their shared experience as they try to lead New Orleans.
Garnett’s bully act goes too far November 3, 2010
Charlie Villanueva says Kevin Garnett called him a “cancer patient.” K.G.‘s legacy suddenly doesn’t look so tough.
Heat’s ferocity looks like quite the show October 30, 2010
LeBron James and Dwyane Wade have delivered on their vision, and the NBA will profit from the carnage.
Heat waiting for stars to align October 28, 2010
As Dwyane Wade and LeBron James remake their games and images, one question lingers: Who leads?
LeBron carries win-now burden with Heat October 27, 2010
LeBron James soon will learn Pat Riley won’t bow to the King, and he’ll be better for it.
Sources: N.Y. scout led improper workouts October 26, 2010
Interviews with players reveal that Knicks scout Rodney Heard apparently violated NBA rules since 2007.
I have flying monkeys at my disposal, and I'm not afraid to use them.
by Lauri on Nov 30, 2010 5:25 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
How is Woj’s scapegoating of LeBron any less craven than the scapegoating of Spoelstra?
Woj didn’t paint a giant target on his OWN back. Lebron asked for this. Until he changes his behavior, he’s still asking for it.
Woj also accurately predicted exactly what would happen with the television announcement and specifically predicted their matchup problems and chemistry issues here at the very beginning of the season.
When was the last time Woj wrote about the actual mechanics of basketball, anyway?
I think the second article is a very good example of that.
Sabre
PS Being mean-spirited to a dick isn’t a bad thing. Stampler is often mean-spirited and his writing kicks ass.
I may be a dick, but I don’t think I’m mean-spirited.
Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
by Aaronstampler on Nov 30, 2010 1:39 PM CST up reply actions
Please excuse me
EDIT: Being a dick to a dick isn’t a bad thing … Stampler is often a dick, and his writing kicks ass.
I’d offer you other analogies, but I like the one you chose. And please understand, I really do mean that as a compliment, whichever way its written. There’s too much understanding and approval in the world today.
Sabre
I actually think that these types of articles ARE his job. Yahoo! has plenty of writers who can talk mechanics; Woj does the human-interest stories. It’s just that so far this season, the stories he’s most interested in are about the Heat.
by DrumsInTheDeep on Nov 30, 2010 7:32 AM CST up reply actions
He covers the filth of the NBA, not the “human interest” stories. Check the last HOF class. Did he write about Robinson, or Stockton? No, he lambasted MJ. It was easy, it sold, so why not?
I smell death... everywhere.
He was also right, and one of only a few writers who refused to give Jordan a tongue bath. But would I have appreciated a Robinson article? Of course!
by DrumsInTheDeep on Nov 30, 2010 7:15 PM CST up reply actions
Anybody who knows about basketball knew Jordan was and will always be a dick. I like Woj because he always knows about the trades and usually breaks the info before anybody else. But what is the purpose of pointing out how most of these guys are jerks and out of touch with reality? That’s like saying water is wet and ice is cold. People kill me when they build these celebrities up to be holier than thou. They are just like everybody else besides having a career that is more in the public eye and getting paid more. And just like every regular person on the globe you have good people and jerks.
One thing i can do...................is FINGER ROLL.
by gunnin' gervin on Dec 5, 2010 7:12 AM CST up reply actions
+1
One thing i can do...................is FINGER ROLL.
by gunnin' gervin on Dec 5, 2010 7:05 AM CST up reply actions
Though it’s hard to argue with words like schadenfreude, I think this is the first time my opinion differs from yours, Lauri (please don’t make me change my sig;) The reason I like Woj calling LeBron out is that, if he’d get over himself, he might live up to his potential…and it makes a nice counterpoint to all the LeBron-love in the media.
Honestly. You kids today, with your hippity-hop music and your Twiddle. - Lauri
by p2cat on Nov 30, 2010 10:36 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Agree with you and Tim B. above. Thing is, when the Spurs swept the Cavs and Timmy said that stuff about the league becoming LeBron’s soon, I really expected that to be the case. But that looks like it’s in the realm of an alternate reality now; in terms of living up to his potential, he’s looking like a LeBomb.
Hey, if posting a sharp, insightful, yet non-sarcastic comment were that easy, even olf would do it.
Mike Monroe: ...the uninformed presume Parker is expendable.
by freshtunarightofftheboat on Nov 30, 2010 5:37 PM CST up reply actions
That may be the first time Timmy’s ever been wrong about anything.
by DrumsInTheDeep on Nov 30, 2010 5:46 PM CST up reply actions
LOVE?
Since his last playoff game for Cleveland the guy has gotten constant bashing. With the Heat struggling to make the lofty expectations many have put on them he is getting even more hate. I also don’t understand the getting over his self and living up his potential angle you are trying to make. Jordan, Kobe, Favre, Lance Armstrong and many other great athletes are all jerks and believe there and the media driven hype and they have become great at what they do. LeBron will get better if he truly cares about getting better and putting in the work to get better. I don’t think he is built like the guys I named earlier in the post though. Which isn’t a bad thing either because neither was David Robinson and many other great athletes.
One thing i can do...................is FINGER ROLL.
by gunnin' gervin on Dec 5, 2010 7:26 AM CST up reply actions
Recced because it is a great counterpoint, but I still love Woj’s writing.
Woj does live off people bashing, but I do not feel that he is manufacturing hate out of thin air, just providing additional insight. Sometimes I instinctively do not like someone, or more accurately, dislike their actions, and Woj perfectly articulates what is bothering me about that athlete or owner.
Lauri: thank goodness I have you magnificent bastards to waste [the offseason] with.
by swgeek on Nov 30, 2010 1:03 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
Yeah, Woj works for Ludden, who always had good sources. So, I doubt he’s making this stuff up, but I think he goes too far sometimes with Lebron. I’ve never read him launch a scathing attack on the personality of other league stars.
Hell, read the stupid Kobe interview from last week. He’s a winner now, so who cares about his personality? His past? Woj doesn’t remember when Kobe wanted a trade, or gave up on his team in the playoffs just as surely as LeBron did last year.
He had the interview, so he focused on Michael Jackson instead. He’s a prick.
I smell death... everywhere.
by LatinD on Nov 30, 2010 6:45 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
So true
how quick people forget when you start winning and keep your mouth shut or say what everybody wants to hear, right? LOL. That is why so many people loved Jordan when he played because he won and publicly never said anything with substance. People like robots or what they perceive to be is squeaky clean.
One thing i can do...................is FINGER ROLL.
by gunnin' gervin on Dec 5, 2010 7:32 AM CST up reply actions
And I’m going to rec you swgeek, because you’ve articulated exactly what I like about Woj’s writing (not the bashing part, but the insight and articulation part).
Hey, if posting a sharp, insightful, yet non-sarcastic comment were that easy, even olf would do it.
Mike Monroe: ...the uninformed presume Parker is expendable.
by freshtunarightofftheboat on Nov 30, 2010 3:56 PM CST up reply actions
that’s an excellent rebuttal Lauri, and I totally understand where you’re coming from. It is true that Wojo is self-righteous and a moralist more than he is an analyst. But like Drums pointed out, I don’t think being an analyst is his job as much as it is to write about the people in the league.
Has Wojo focused on the Heat in general and LeBron specifically an awful lot? No doubt. Like you said, that’s what gets the page hits. Has he been “picking on” LeBron too much? That’s probably accurate. Does he have an agenda based on his personal feelings on LeBron? It sure seems that way. His act can be overkill. I don’t deny any of these points.
My only counter would be this: It seems to me that Yahoo sports has made a philosophical choice to be the counterpoint to ESPN. ESPN is in bed with the athletes they cover and everyone in our business understands this. Not only was “The Decision” covered on their airwaves, but their employees make a point of being fawning and gushing toward star athletes. As long as they produce on the field or the court, their personality flaws or off-field/court transgressions are largely ignored.
Look at the situations with Brett Favre or Ben Roethlisberger. ESPN did not address them until they absolutely had to, after Yahoo, SI, AOL, CBS Sports and Deadspin were all over them. Same thing with LeBron as a “villain.” ESPN has only recently, perhaps two or three days ago, understood that anti-James sentiment is a big seller and covered his shoulder bump with Spoelstra with Zapruder-film like intensity.
Still, they’ve made a point as an entity to not reveal to their readers/viewers just what a dick the guy is. That’s all kept in house.
Wojo’s KG story is also something that would’ve never been allowed at ESPN. They love him over there and most of their analysts took his side that Villanueva was out of bounds for revealing something that was said to him on the court.
The way I look at is this, it’s kinda like how Fox News and MSNBC cover political news. They’re addressing the same topics, but with completely different spins. ESPN and Yahoo are the same way, and it’s up to each individual fan to figure out for themselves which angle they prefer, or to pick and choose certain aspects of both, as I do.
Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
by Aaronstampler on Nov 30, 2010 2:21 PM CST up reply actions 6 recs
I like your comparison of Yahoo! and ESPN to Fox and MSNBC.
As for whether Woj has focused on the Heat and LeBron too much and specifically picking on LeBron, I think we have to put it in the context of the question of whether the sports media overall has been giving a 0.500 club too much coverage or fawning over/criticizing one of the club’s players too much.
And lest we forget, much of this ‘news’ is manufactured and disseminated by LeBron’s own camp, straight into the mouths of a hungry press. Woj provides a nice counterbalance to the way certain media manipulators would like us to see things… he probes beyond surface appearances to reveal something more believable to me.
Hey, if posting a sharp, insightful, yet non-sarcastic comment were that easy, even olf would do it.
Mike Monroe: ...the uninformed presume Parker is expendable.
by freshtunarightofftheboat on Nov 30, 2010 4:12 PM CST up reply actions
IDK
Maybe on ESPN.com they were not bashing LeBron but all over the network he was getting roasted after the Boston series. They do kiss a lot of the athletes butts on ESPN but they have so many different channels and websites that it is actually a lot more balanced than what you are making it out to be with the truth telling or bashing. Not all the host have the same ideas or views as the writers on the websites. That is one of the reasons why I like ESPN so much because they seem to make an effort to have people and shows that make that point. Like PTI, Around the Horn, The Sports Reporters, Mike and Mike, First and Ten and many other shows.
One thing i can do...................is FINGER ROLL.
by gunnin' gervin on Dec 5, 2010 7:41 AM CST up reply actions
also, Lauri… there is this. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JSCoLWJZnL8
I mean, the poor kid is standing there, literally a foot away, looking right at the dude with his hand stuck out, and James makes a point of purposefully throwing his shit on the ground away from him. It’s just demeaning.
Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
by Aaronstampler on Nov 30, 2010 3:48 PM CST up reply actions
“King” James seems not to care for anyone else.
Hey, if posting a sharp, insightful, yet non-sarcastic comment were that easy, even olf would do it.
Mike Monroe: ...the uninformed presume Parker is expendable.
by freshtunarightofftheboat on Nov 30, 2010 4:02 PM CST up reply actions
I’ve heard people defend James about that video, but to me that behavior is hard to condone — under any circumstances.
As a counterpoint: after Friday’s loss to the Mavs, I heard Matt Bonner apologize to a locker room attendant because a shirt he’d tried to kick to him had gone away from, instead of toward, the guy whose job it was to pick that stuff up. He didn’t just say, “Sorry.” He said, “Oh, wow. I’m sorry. That was a bad kick!”
This isn’t to make Matt out to be a saint in opposition to James’ Mephistopheles, it’s just an anecdote to illustrate how these guys live in an environment where people walk around behind them to clean up their messes. It’s a normal occurrence that they’re entirely familiar with. To make excuses for the way James went out of his way to ignore that kid, is tantamount to arguing that he is completely clueless to the point of being incapable of understanding the simplest type of human interaction.
There’s a reason why videos like that are compelling to watch. It’s because they’re so telling.
RJ2.0: vive la différence.
these guys live in an environment where people walk around behind them to clean up their messes
I think the mess the Heat and Bron-Bron are making may be too big for anyone to clean up at this point.
Hey, if posting a sharp, insightful, yet non-sarcastic comment were that easy, even olf would do it.
Mike Monroe: ...the uninformed presume Parker is expendable.
by freshtunarightofftheboat on Nov 30, 2010 5:40 PM CST up reply actions
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-JFfN5pKzFU
Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
by Aaronstampler on Nov 30, 2010 6:19 PM CST up reply actions
Matt IS a saint, though. He’s the Patron Saint of longbowmen, sandwiches, and poor interior defense.
by DrumsInTheDeep on Nov 30, 2010 5:48 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
GOL!… and rec’d.
Hey, if posting a sharp, insightful, yet non-sarcastic comment were that easy, even olf would do it.
Mike Monroe: ...the uninformed presume Parker is expendable.
by freshtunarightofftheboat on Nov 30, 2010 5:54 PM CST up reply actions
I was about to write about how I thought Woj was a prick, a paparazzi-with-a-pen. Then I noticed that Lauri had replied. Thanks for being so damn smart.
I smell death... everywhere.
Well put
I am so tired of hearing about the Heat and LeBron. They talk about them more than the damn Lakers who are the champions. It seems like it is the media’s personal mission to vilify or scrutinize everything that teams does. There is a whole lot of good stories the media could be talking about so far in this early part of the NBA season yet damn near every outlet keeps talking about one team. It is ridiculous.
One thing i can do...................is FINGER ROLL.
by gunnin' gervin on Dec 5, 2010 7:03 AM CST up reply actions
Lauri’s take on Woj,as usual, is on point in my opinion. In fact, again as usual, she has painted it beautifully what I have in my head :P
I just hate his righteous moralizing tone in everything. Not that I like leebrawn, but too much is too much. Leave the ‘too much’ to Leebrawn to ‘continue his greatness’.
Fox
Fox News is not a news network. It is a propaganda network pure and simple. It has no regard whatsoever for facts, science, truth, journalism. Our nation and its relations with the rest of the world would be much better off if Americans understood that and if true® media outlets treated them as such. They deserve no legitimacy at all. Please don’t give them any.
I think ESPN and Fox News are fairly similar, actually. 98% of their operations are utter bullshit, but they each employ a couple of people who have fallen through the cracks and aren’t completely awful, soulless human beings.
Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
by Aaronstampler on Nov 30, 2010 3:41 PM CST up reply actions
Are you saying that “FOX News” is an oxymoron? The list of things they claim that are contra-indicated: “fair and balanced,” “no-spin zone,” etc. is truly staggering, lol It’s as if a Marketing Dept. got control of a journalism school. :)
Hey, if posting a sharp, insightful, yet non-sarcastic comment were that easy, even olf would do it.
Mike Monroe: ...the uninformed presume Parker is expendable.
by freshtunarightofftheboat on Nov 30, 2010 4:15 PM CST up reply actions
I suppose ABC, CNN, NBC and the like are legitimate? Everybody spins, it’s up to people to be smart enough to look at all the angles and come up with a reasonable conclusion. As my grandpa said, “Don’t trust nobody”
P.S. Our Nation and it’s relations with the rest of the world haven’t changed since Fox News started.
by comparison, yes. Nothing is absolute, all news organizations have flaws… but “Fox News” is really an oxymoron.
Hey, if posting a sharp, insightful, yet non-sarcastic comment were that easy, even olf would do it.
Mike Monroe: ...the uninformed presume Parker is expendable.
by freshtunarightofftheboat on Nov 30, 2010 4:44 PM CST up reply actions
There is spin on everything. The problem I have with Fox is not their bias (which they take much further than everyone else), but the hate and vitriol they constantly spew. The worst part is that other networks are noticing that hate sells and are slowly changing their language as well. The trend is not good.
Lauri: thank goodness I have you magnificent bastards to waste [the offseason] with.
Julian's days at the helm of that organization are numbered ...
In the meantime, thank goodness for denial-of-service attacks.
P.S. Our Nation and it’s relations with the rest of the world haven’t changed since Fox News started.
From my gut, I’d have to disagree. We haven’t seen misinformation so well constructed, organized, directed, and executed on such a wide-spread, cohesive level with such success in quite a long time.
gospursgo. hook 'em. metal rules. ganja rules.
by metalandganja on Nov 30, 2010 5:47 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
crap, i meant to post that as a reply to the above comment. my bad.
gospursgo. hook 'em. metal rules. ganja rules.
by metalandganja on Nov 30, 2010 5:48 PM CST up reply actions
Relations with other nations
Read world newspapers, you’ll find a level of disdain for the U.S. that goes way beyond anything in the past … by far. There is a direct correlation between how Fox News (yes, indeed, it is an oxymoron) has given monetary and propaganda support to the Rep. Party and it’s feeling of empowerment to try and block the Start non-proliferation treaty dialogue. And if you don’t think that has serious consequences for this nation and how the world sees us, you need to take a polisci 101 class. Of course, Americans should be smart, informed and discerning enough to distinguish between news and propaganda, but they’re not and that has grave consequences which we are experiencing every day and what the future of this nation looks like.
I figured I would be in the minority, and y’all make some good arguments. But the upshot is that far from being some sort of truth-teller, Woj is just another spin-doctor. If I watched ESPN, his “counterbalance” might feel more necessary to me. But I just watch the games. (By the way, I would argue that LeBron-bashing is the norm these days, not some sort of courageous stand against the mainstream.)
As long as they produce on the field or the court, their personality flaws or off-field/court transgressions are largely ignored.
This is the way athletes have been treated since time immemorial. It is only in the last few decades with the advances in communication that have made micro-inspection and instant reportage possible that athletes, celebrities, politicians, octo-moms, etc. have been subject to constant observation. It’s like a dissection that never ends. Reporting on personalities has been reduced to 24/7 shallow analysis and knee-jerk conclusions about their every individual action. Some good has come of that, certainly, but so has a lot of bad. Some people make a living out of trying to stay in the spotlight, but that’s no different than it has ever been. I think it’s unfair to say that athletes who are very very good at what they do are “asking for it” somehow. Honestly, how many NBA athletes do you think would look good under the sort of scrutiny LeBron James or Brett Favre gets? Forget athletes, how many PEOPLE do you think could emerge unscathed from it? They get focused on because they are the best at what they do. What about all those other less talented players who have said horrible things to other people or used their status to gain some sort of sexual advantage or refused to sign some kid’s jersey, hmm? Should we let them off the hook just because they aren’t phenomenally gifted? Hell no, let’s start a database of wretched deeds and keep track of every idiotic thing they say! Um, no.
I think it’s fairly obvious that Kevin Garnett and LeBron James and certain other players have some character flaws (and I’ve said as much in various comments over the months—I didn’t need Woj to point them out to me). I don’t think making a career out of reporting those character flaws in loving, repetitive detail is some sort of noble endeavor, though. Adrian Wojnarowski is no Gay Talese, and his shrill, self-righteous harping about James is no Silent Season of a Hero. There’s no analysis taking place in Woj’s work. I’m not learning anything. Not about basketball, not about humans, not about life.
But let me stress again that y’all made a number of good points. The fawning and the complicity exhibited by ESPN and other media outlets can be not just irritating but troubling. It’s just that I happen to find the alternative spiteful pursuit supplied by outlets like Deadspin and writers like Woj every bit as troubling. So . . . agree to disagree?
I have flying monkeys at my disposal, and I'm not afraid to use them.
by Lauri on Nov 30, 2010 6:05 PM CST reply actions 2 recs
Ok… but could I add just one more thing?
I agree that people in the media spotlight get way more scrutiny than is really healthy for society. But here’s the thing about LeBron… he crafted a public image for his benefit and profit, one of a good guy from humble beginnings, a fun-loving character with a big heart who loves his teammates and whose mission is to deliver a championship to his ‘home town.’ So it isn’t surprising that when things about his personality and character that are at odds with that image he promoted come out, that he gets bashed, and hard. Everyone is disappointed, and a little angry, for being fooled by the P.R.
Count me as one of those. I was taken in by the whole thing, thought that he was uncommonly mature for his age based on the things he said. But when I started noticing the things he actually did, I realized I had bought the image he was selling.
Hey, if posting a sharp, insightful, yet non-sarcastic comment were that easy, even olf would do it.
Mike Monroe: ...the uninformed presume Parker is expendable.
by freshtunarightofftheboat on Dec 1, 2010 12:24 AM CST up reply actions
I feel the same, was disappointed that it was all a front. I guess being a mom I tend to think of the kids watching these stars and wanting to be just like them. So happy we have some of the best examples right here in SA, choose one…Tim or Manu. Both are exceptional on and off the court.
I see Laura’s point as well, it’s been said, we know now. Ignore the big jerk and maybe when he quits getting all of the attention, he might decide it’s time to grow up.
You know he’s watching the Spurs and wondering – Why do they get to win so often? Here let me break it down for you LeBron. Great coach, wonderful work ethic, humble players that realize that it takes a TEAM to win a championship.
Timmy D .... enough said.
Great coach, wonderful work ethic, humble players that realize that it takes a TEAM to win a championship.
And this, which I doubt LeBron — who seems to be concerned more about the trappings of success (e.g. adulation, acclaim, attention, etc.) than actually winning — will ever find or even understand:
We don’t think about whether you’re being respected or disrespected or forgotten about or thought about, because I think everybody is very mature and realizes that that’s all irrelevant. All that matters is if you win or not, so we pretty much have concentrated on that for a long, long time now. That will just continue. We don’t really care.
— Gregg Popovich
I just hope that Pop, when it’s really all over, sits down and writes a motivational book about winning and winners and “pounding the rock.”
Hey, if posting a sharp, insightful, yet non-sarcastic comment were that easy, even olf would do it.
Mike Monroe: ...the uninformed presume Parker is expendable.
by freshtunarightofftheboat on Dec 1, 2010 10:55 AM CST up reply actions
I agree with far more points you have made in this post than I disagree with (and you know that I’m always ready to agree to disagree with you :) and I appreciate the thoughtful and restrained manner with which you’ve commented about all of this, but I do have one more thing to add.
While I believe that becoming an athlete isn’t synonymous with asking to have your entire life put under the spotlights, I feel that Mr. James (what I’ll be calling him until further notice) has definitely invited more examination and inspection as a result of his stated desire to be a global icon. He’s set his sights far beyond success on the basketball court, and so I believe that a good deal of the additional focus he receives is warranted.
I’m not saying that he deserves anything that’s regularly hurled his way, or that Woj is justified in constantly keeping Mr. James under the microscope — I just believe the average athlete is allowed is a certain amount of latitude that is being denied Mr. James, because of the goals he has set for himself.
That’s all.
RJ2.0: vive la différence.
We´re not divided. Just different opinions about some subjects.
The main subject of PTR´s is the Spurs. And about that we´re pretty united
I thought this was a good and respectful discussion—I don’t feel separated or divided into sides, and I don’t think Stampler sees it that way either (feel free to smack me down if I’m wrong, Erler :p). When you get into deep discussion and hence expose yourself as invested in a particular view of life or philosophy, you always run the risk of hearing snide little comments from people who for whatever reason respond with condescension or belittlement (maybe they’re uncomfortable with sincerity), but this kind of thing is what I love most. I learn from you non-gender-specific guys and from this sort of deeper discussion, and I’m grateful for that. Sometimes it takes a while to sink in and synthesize, but somewhere down the road I’ll have a more nuanced response to something or experience a richer moment that might not even have a thing to do with basketball, and it will be because of stuff like this.
And oh yeah,
Go Spurs Go!
I have flying monkeys at my disposal, and I'm not afraid to use them.
by Lauri on Nov 30, 2010 8:14 PM CST up reply actions 4 recs
Lauri has got to be the sweetest person on PtR. There is balance in the universe, and she is the answer to SinCity :-).
Lauri: thank goodness I have you magnificent bastards to waste [the offseason] with.
Damn, I meant SiMA, not SinCity.
Lauri: thank goodness I have you magnificent bastards to waste [the offseason] with.
Thank YOU for the respectful and interesting discussion, Lauri.
Hey, if posting a sharp, insightful, yet non-sarcastic comment were that easy, even olf would do it.
Mike Monroe: ...the uninformed presume Parker is expendable.
by freshtunarightofftheboat on Dec 1, 2010 2:30 PM CST up reply actions
Another viewpoint from Yahoo
Good points all.
Lauri: thank goodness I have you magnificent bastards to waste [the offseason] with.
Stan van Gundy is a good coach, but he couldn’t coach Shaq. Erik Spoelstra is a good coach, but he cannot coach LeBron. LeBron needs a coach with a fistful of rings and a megawatt ego. A coach who coached the greatest players and won the ultimate prize. When Riley will return on the bench again, the Heat will look like a different team. Of course, this all doesn’t mean that LeBron is not a prick. He is a prick. What else is new?
"We lost so many games that we shouldn't have lost," - Ginobili, May 2010
Woj strikes again: Cavaliers now investigating the Heat for illegal tampering.
Does it matter? Will it change anything? Not really.
Heat issue official response:
What should we do? Should we admit we were wrong? Should we say we’re sorry? Should we apologize for tampering?
Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
by Aaronstampler on Dec 1, 2010 5:13 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
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