I hate to be a Negative Nancy but...
Yeah, I'm officially concerned about the Jefferson trade, for quite a few reasons.
Guess which of these two gentlemen I'd rather have?
My initial reaction to the trade? A tiny flicker of excitement, before my brain kicked in, and the more I learn, the more I think, the less I like it. I know I'm in the minority here, but as a stand alone move I don't like this. I don't like this one bit.
First of all, I've never been much impressed by Jefferson as a player. I never thought of him as a difference maker in any way. If anything, he was the epitome of the kind of guy that made me appreciate being a Spurs fan, the kind of overrated, grossly overpaid, score 18-give up 22 player that our organization has smartly avoided like the herp for the better part of a decade.
Yes, Jefferson shot 40% from downtown last season. Yes, he's 6-7 and a legitimate small forward. And yes, he's likely to throw down a dunk or two per game. Those things are all well and good.
But let's look closer. He's not that young, he's 29. He finished a -104 last season, the second worst figure on the team. The team's defense and offense, was better with him OFF the floor, according to 82games.com. The guy is a shitty, unwilling passer, our offense has always emphasized making the extra pass and last year Jefferson averaged one assist for every 15 minutes of floor time.
Should I go on?
Okay, how about this. His PER last year was 15.45, barely abover average and the second lowest mark of his career, in what was supposed to be his prime. Also, for a guy with his athleticism, he came up with only 66 steals and 14 blocks in nearly 3,000 minutes on the floor. Not exactly an active defender. Also, the guy had 20 double-doubles in the '05-06 season. He's had five since.
Basically we're getting a player on the decline, he's getting paid a ridiculous salary, he's on the books for three years, he's not a Spurs type of player, and he's going to have to learn a whole new offensive and defensive system, where traditionally players have struggled here in their first seasons.
Now let's look at how this move impacts the rest of the team.
Obviously my first concern is how this effects Manu. What this acquisition tells me is that Pop and the rest of the FO have no confidence whatsoever that he's going to have a good season next year, and that even if he does, they're still not planning on re-signing him. Suppose Manu does surprise everyone and has another 6MOY-worthy season next year, and the team offers him a 3-year, 30M contract. That would mean 59 MILLION SMACKERS (22.2 for Tim, 12.6 for Tony, 14.2 for RJ, 10.0 for Manu) committed to four players in '10-11. That would mean 57.4 MILLION SMACKERS to four guys in '11-12 (18.7 for Tim, 15.2 for RJ,13.5 for Tony, 10.0 for Manu).
Does that sound realistic to you? Me 'neither.
It looks like a one year window, at best, for the Spurs to contend with Manu and Jefferson. After that, it appears that they've made their decision and will move on with Jefferson as their third wheel.
And that's IF they give Manu the whole year. Remember, he's an expiring contract too, just like Bruce, Kurt and Fab were. His contract has major value for a team looking to add a star for a postseason run at the trade deadline and then have that salary cap room to play with the next summer. I think the odds of Manu being traded this seaon went up like 500%, and it wouldn't shock me at all to see him moved even in the draft, if they want to get into the top five or so. The Washington deal makes way more sense now, with the Spurs getting bigs like Andray Blatche and Etan Thomas/Brendan Haywood and the fifth pick (for James Harden, a lefty shooting guard out of Arizona State who models his game after Manu) for Manu.
Basically, I'm going to be a nervous wreck on Thursday night now, at least until the first ten or so picks are off the board, and I'm already mentally preparing for the worst. My Ginobili jersey will, in all likelihood, be a throwback after this season. Jefferson's monster salary makes it a near certainty.
Even if Manu isn't traded at all this year, I can see what the team is thinking. It's his contract year, let's get one last monster season out of him when he's super motivated to prove everyone wrong, and then let him go anyway, since he's never gonna do it again.
Finally, we have to consider the lack of bigs on the roster. Right now we have Tim, puddin' Bonner, and Ian. Mahinmi hasn't played a meaningful minute in his career and is as fragile as an egg. Surely Pop can't be betting the farm on him. And we saw last year that Bonner has too many faults to be counted on. Maybe James Gist will come aboard, but he's a bit undersized to count on for solid rebounding. The mid-level exception is our only hope, and it better be used on somebody worth a damn. Again, I'm cringing in fear about a Washington/Manu draft trade. It makes too much sense now.
I hardly recognize the Spurs anymore. They're all but completely abandoning defense and rebounding with this trade. It appears the front office was inspired by Orlando's playoff run and are thinking Orlando's offense + experience = championship. We'll see how it works out. I'm sure it won't be a problem at all for Tony and Manu that this fuckwit has the second highest salary on the team now.
It's gonna be a couple of rough nights at the Stampler household.
2 recs |
69 comments
Comments
All good points, but I hope you’re wrong.
Free James Gist!
Pounding the Rock - where ochlocracy happens. Eat your heart out, California.
by Tim C. on Jun 23, 2009 3:44 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Dotn worry pop and ducan can take these type of players and change their attiude. OR at least while there in san antinio. Rember a guy named stephon jakson?
GO SPURS GO
SPURS 2010 NBA Champions (if team is healty LoL)
by Manu-20 on Jun 24, 2009 6:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Other than “worry” and “change,” I’m pretty sure you successfully misspelled every word in that post. Well done, Manu-20, welcome to the Rock.
"If I was the kind of guy who posted a signature line, this would be it from now on." -SiMA
by SgtinManusArmy on Jun 24, 2009 6:48 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Is Stephon Jakson a cross between Stephon Marbury and Stephen Jackson? God help us all.
by silverandblack_davis on Jun 24, 2009 7:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
haha that makes me feel better
...formerly known as speedostuffer
by Manuwar on Jun 24, 2009 9:48 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I see your point but I’m in favor of the trade. It sure beats the hell out of Finley/Bowen/Ime rotation. And I would bet money that trading Manu for the 5th pick is not even being considered after making this trade. The FO is not ready to blow this thing up, yet. Now I can’t speak for next year…
Superman wears Manu Ginobili pajamas to bed.
by CMoney on Jun 23, 2009 3:45 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Thought provoking post
However, I have one minor quibble. RJ’s contract actually expires after the 2010-2011 season. I don’t think Manu’s going anywhere this season either. The FO is making a huge run for the chip next season, as we’re now staring the luxury tax square in the face. I also see a move being made for someone like Rasheed Wallace, and a feeler put out for a Paul Milshap type. Relax, 2009-2010 is going to be glorious.
"There's a thin line between to laugh with and to laugh at." - Richard Pryor
by DennardC on Jun 23, 2009 3:56 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I wouldn’t put too much stock in RJ’s numbers with the Bucks. Moving to a title contender will make all the difference in his motivation.
The Spurs might try to move up in the draft, but I don’t see them trying to go as high as #5.
by 4Him on Jun 23, 2009 4:51 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Scrappy's random transient check in...
Stamp, it’s important to remember that Jefferson played on a lousy team for a lousy coach, who subscribed to the “get the ball to michael redd early and often” theory. The Spurs are an organization that has not only the competence, but the ability to maximize a player’s potential, as well as assimilate it into a team wide plan of attack. Bruce Bowen was seen as a waste prior to his joining the Spurs, as were quite a few others throughout our prominence. The bottom line is that while stats reflect a lot about a player, they can’t refelct intangibles like the aforementioned. The bottomest line is that Jefferson provides athleticism (as well as stamina, judging from the fact that he didnt miss a game all season last year, despite being on a horrible team and having every reason to throw in the towel) that we have SORELY needed in seasons past, none more so than this most recent. I think any Spurs fan who happened to witness the third quarter in any game we played this season would agree.
"I like to use my pump fake to make them come hard, that's when I use my penetration." -Manu Ginobili
by scrappy-doo on Jun 23, 2009 5:29 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Glad you’re back scrappy. That manu quote never fails to give me a chuckle.
Superman wears Manu Ginobili pajamas to bed. - CMoney
I don't like chatty. I don't do chatty. I like quiet. Quiet and mean. Those are my people. - Nurse Jackie
by bellasa on Jun 23, 2009 7:13 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Welcome back, scrappy. Where’ve you been?
Straight from the No-Stat Zone to your computer!
Dunkin' Cheerleaders
by LatinD on Jun 23, 2009 7:53 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
skating...
all the time… I was also fired from my last job for telling my manager that I didnt respect her as a professional, or a person. I iced that cake by telling her, and then HR to go fuck themselves. It was a real kodak moment up in there…
"I like to use my pump fake to make them come hard, that's when I use my penetration." -Manu Ginobili
by scrappy-doo on Jun 23, 2009 10:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nice.
Screw the fact that we’re in a down economy, that chits just cool.
"If I was the kind of guy who posted a signature line, this would be it from now on." -SiMA
by SgtinManusArmy on Jun 23, 2009 10:44 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You’re such a hardcore skater.
Straight from the No-Stat Zone to your computer!
Dunkin' Cheerleaders
by LatinD on Jun 24, 2009 7:44 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good counter-argument, scrappy. However, I remember a point in Jefferson’s career where he missed a lot of games spanning 2 seasons because of injuries. Makes me worry if last season’s injury-free ride was a fluke.
by silverandblack_davis on Jun 23, 2009 8:14 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
haha...
James Gist, at 6’9", is too small for rebounding… We should all be so goddamn unfortunate…
"I like to use my pump fake to make them come hard, that's when I use my penetration." -Manu Ginobili
by scrappy-doo on Jun 23, 2009 5:39 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
i hate to bring his name again and again but scola is 6`7 and he rebounds ok to me
"It's a basic truth of the human condition that everybody lies. The only variable is about what."
by Chilai on Jun 24, 2009 4:44 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
and by ok i mean that double-doubles are his daily diet
"It's a basic truth of the human condition that everybody lies. The only variable is about what."
by Chilai on Jun 24, 2009 4:45 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t know what kind of metric to The Right American Way converter you are using but Scola is 6’ 9".
SORRY. LET ME WRITE THAT SO YOU CAN HEAR IT. SCOLA IS 6’ 9".
We specialize in misinformation around here. Facts and stats just get in the way.
by Wayne Vore (ATS) on Jun 24, 2009 6:09 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
RECC’D to a metric yard stick
I want my Bruuuuuuuuce
by jollyrogerwilco on Jun 25, 2009 10:39 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
he is 6’8 at best, with crocodile like arms (similar to bonner’s). What helps him is that he doesnt have a lot of neck (a waste of height and the reason guys like Primoz Brezec shouldnt be measured by traditional height)
"Rock and Roll angels bring that HardRock Hallelujah"
by Chilai on Jun 25, 2009 11:10 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
even at 6’9 my point still is right, the gist should be able to get rebounds. Getting them its not only a matter of height and atlheticism, there’s a lot of ability involved. Just think of Chuck Hayes, Reggie Evans, Danny Fortson, Landry and of course the almighty Rodman and Barkley.
"Rock and Roll angels bring that HardRock Hallelujah"
by Chilai on Jun 25, 2009 11:12 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
espn lists him at 6’ 9". I SAID…
But yeah, rebounding is about a hell of a lot more than height. Arms, jumping ability, instincts, animal craziness, positioning, elbows, hands, etc.
We specialize in misinformation around here. Facts and stats just get in the way.
by Wayne Vore (ATS) on Jun 25, 2009 11:57 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
and DESIRE
I want my Bruuuuuuuuce
by jollyrogerwilco on Jun 25, 2009 12:58 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Didn’t I say animal craziness?
We specialize in misinformation around here. Facts and stats just get in the way.
by Wayne Vore (ATS) on Jun 25, 2009 1:13 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
or better yet, animial magnetism.
We specialize in misinformation around here. Facts and stats just get in the way.
by Wayne Vore (ATS) on Jun 25, 2009 3:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
ESPN is not a very acurate site let me tell you. That Michael Beasley was suposed to be a 6`10 interior presence. He looks like a 6`8 SF.
"Rock and Roll angels bring that HardRock Hallelujah"
by Chilai on Jun 25, 2009 2:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Even if Manu isn’t traded at all this year, I can see what the team is thinking. It’s his contract year, let’s get one last monster season out of him when he’s super motivated to prove everyone wrong, and then let him go anyway, since he’s never gonna do it again.
This is foolish. Has Manu EVER not been motivated. He is a motivational machine!
You do have a good point about the lack of bigs in the rotation but I think Jefferson is a basketball player and he fixes some of the squads most pressing issues. I just hopes Manu stays : (
"If an expert says it can't be done, get another expert"
- DBG
by LasEspuelas on Jun 23, 2009 5:44 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Manu > RJ…The FO knows that. This is a clear sign that we are going for chips. You don’t take on a bad contract just to put yourself in the same spot or worse the next season. This is our big 4 until Duncan leaves. I also think the Spurs could use the 2010 market which will be most competitive for other stars to possibly get a steal on Manu. The cap likely isn’t going to increase next year (and may go down again) so a lot of teams will be in the same position they are now.
His contract has major value for a team looking to add a star for a postseason run at the trade deadline and then have that salary cap room to play with the next summer.
The type of player and value our own Spurs will need? We need that expiring contract to sign….well, Manu back. We need a star for a postseason run like….well, Manu. Aren’t you sick and tired of our FO desperately trying moves at the trade deadline for big name players like Carter, Jefferson, Camby, Maggette, etc. and falling short every time? Then we settle for players like KT or Gooden. This time our FO said, “FUCK THIS SHIT!!! WE WANT RICHARD JEFFERSON AND WE WILL HAVE MOTHER FUCKING RICHARD JEFFERSON!”
Holt and our FO just told us, the fans, and every FA that San Antonio is the place to be if you want to be part of a contender. Before the trade, everyone thought we were on our deathbed. This is just the first move and our front court will be bolstered in the draft and FA market, and when Splitter comes next year…..
by BlaseE on Jun 23, 2009 6:37 PM CDT reply actions 4 recs
Exactly. +1, BE.
Straight from the No-Stat Zone to your computer!
Dunkin' Cheerleaders
by LatinD on Jun 23, 2009 7:53 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Whoa, you just turned up my motivation motor up a notch, Blase. Great stuff.
by silverandblack_davis on Jun 23, 2009 8:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
FUCKING YES
"It's a basic truth of the human condition that everybody lies. The only variable is about what."
by Chilai on Jun 24, 2009 4:45 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
HAHAHAHAHAHA
epic post man
13 points in 39 seconds. Enough said.
by Duhoh on Jun 27, 2009 4:33 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You can breath easy Stampler…
"If an expert says it can't be done, get another expert"
- DBG
by LasEspuelas on Jun 23, 2009 6:42 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I was just coming here to post that...
One thing to consider about his +/-…he was the top scoring player for the Bucks last season over 82 games (35 mpg). When you are that guy, the opposing team coaches (subs) for you. You are playing against the best and for the most minutes. The more minutes you play on a mediocre team, the more your +/- slowly falls. That stat is absolutely shit in RJ’s case.
Next season, I see Parker, Romaju, RJ, Duncan, and Ian (or new player) starting. Manu and Hill will be an excellent backcourt sub and RJ and Duncan will stay out to maintain consistency on the court. Maybe then Bonner comes in then to see if he is hot that night. Gist can sub in for Duncan. And last Finley, Hairston, Williams, or some new player subs for RJ and other starters come back in. That is an excellent rotation and we still have pieces to add to it like Bowen coming back. There will always be a 20 pt scorer or two on the floor. That is just unstoppable. Teams won’t be able to stay on RJ or double team him because Manu will be creating havok, Duncan will be Duncaning it up on the side of the paint or Tony will be driving in the paint and collapsing the D. I think RJ is going to have a great season. Then think about the games you watched last season with only Tony of the big 3 or just Tony and Duncan or just Tony and Manu. Jefferson makes those lineups infinitely more potent on offense.
by BlaseE on Jun 23, 2009 6:56 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah you beat me to it
" Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes, that way when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have their shoes. "
by Bushka on Jun 23, 2009 7:29 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Im smelling a DPOY for duncan, i dont know why
"It's a basic truth of the human condition that everybody lies. The only variable is about what."
by Chilai on Jun 24, 2009 4:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I appreciate that you always try to avoid getting caught up in the excitement and look at the cold, hard truth, Stampizzle, but this all sounds like the usual caveats we all read whenever a big trade is made. Basically, “it might not work.” That’s true, but it usually does. Why? Because more talent usually trumps less talent, and RJ represents a major upgrade from last season’s roster.
We’ve got this chit.
Straight from the No-Stat Zone to your computer!
Dunkin' Cheerleaders
by LatinD on Jun 23, 2009 7:56 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I think the biggest difference for RJ next season will be his workload – we won’t ask him to do as much, which will make his role much easier.
Free James Gist!
Pounding the Rock - where ochlocracy happens. Eat your heart out, California.
by Tim C. on Jun 23, 2009 7:57 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ramen. I was thinking the exact same thing.
Plus, he gets great teachers in TD and Pop. I also have a lot of faith in the San Antonio Spurs culture, and its ability to help a player “get over himself,” as Pop likes to say.
by silverandblack_davis on Jun 23, 2009 8:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
To add to LD’s point. Isn’t it nice to see our FO taking a calculated risk in order to get us back to breathing champion air?! I’ve never bought into the “it might not work” way of thinking. Well no shit it might not work. That can be said about every risk, ever taken, and every great idea. At the end of the day we can only put ourselves in the best position to succeed. And that’s exactly what we’ve done here. The rest will be decided between the lines.
Superman wears Manu Ginobili pajamas to bed.
by CMoney on Jun 23, 2009 11:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Scott Adams, the creator of Dilbert, always says that no one can tell a genius idea and complete foolishness apart — until after the fact. PtR has been having a site-wide celebration since this has been announced, and now Stamp has shown us the complete foolishness angle. So, nothing but the rest of the season will determine which of the two we’ve just witnessed.
I want my Manu!
by jollyrogerwilco on Jun 23, 2009 11:37 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The only thing I don’t like about this trade is that it didn’t happen last season.
...formerly known as speedostuffer
by Manuwar on Jun 23, 2009 8:57 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Take off the tin-foil hat and enjoy the first offseason in over a decade in which the SPURS FO is doing everything possible to win.
And keep it down; Bigfoot could hear you.
And so could Farmar.
"If I was the kind of guy who posted a signature line, this would be it from now on." -SiMA
by SgtinManusArmy on Jun 23, 2009 10:44 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Nice Farmar reference.
Superman wears Manu Ginobili pajamas to bed.
by CMoney on Jun 23, 2009 10:58 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Going all nerdy on us
Did you just make a mythological creature reference?
I want my Manu!
by jollyrogerwilco on Jun 23, 2009 11:38 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Over a decade? That’s quite a statement. Sometimes “doing everything possible to win” means not being active in the market, and keeping your core intact while maintaining good chemistry. For the Spurs, such strategy has resulted in championships.
by 4Him on Jun 23, 2009 11:41 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Careful there, 4Him. That savors strongly of logic. Can’t have too much of that around here, ya know.
I want my Manu!
by jollyrogerwilco on Jun 23, 2009 11:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Especially in this state of drunken euphoria
...formerly known as speedostuffer
by Manuwar on Jun 23, 2009 11:56 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Quoting a litlle bit of Obama, “Change has come… to San Antonio.”
by silverandblack_davis on Jun 24, 2009 12:02 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/hyperbole
"If I was the kind of guy who posted a signature line, this would be it from now on." -SiMA
by SgtinManusArmy on Jun 24, 2009 12:29 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sublime
I want my Bruuuuuuuuce
by jollyrogerwilco on Jun 24, 2009 2:18 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sorry, mate. I had just woken up and obviously missed the boat. You’ve got a great sense of humor, and obviously it’s sometimes too good for me.
by 4Him on Jun 24, 2009 7:33 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Btw, I just saw Buford being interviewed about the trade (see spurs.com), and he basically said, “Tell SiMA that he can shove his hyperbole!” There you have it.
by 4Him on Jun 24, 2009 9:00 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wow, I agree with my fellow Coloradan. I view this as a “playing to win” move, as opposed to some of the FO’s previous “playing not to lose” moves.
Also, for future reference Stampler, some of us Nancys aren’t negative, we’re just cranky.
by CapHill on Jun 24, 2009 12:28 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Don’t give me that. We both already agreed that the roads and highways system here is crap; that’s at least something.
"If I was the kind of guy who posted a signature line, this would be it from now on." -SiMA
by SgtinManusArmy on Jun 24, 2009 12:31 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t even live there and I’ll agree with that. Colorado roads suck!
by Big50 on Jun 24, 2009 9:34 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
FO is trying to bring another non-spur-type of guy and re-shape him. sometimes this works. sometimes not. stampler is right to bring up the possibility of how this would negatively impact manu – but manu isnt going anywhere.
by bones on Jun 24, 2009 7:33 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I understand where you’re coming from Stamp. I think you’re off base a little bit with RJ’s stats, but I can understand your concern. If this FO just makes this move this off season I’ll be shocked. Perhaps they’ll do something that will make you like this trade more.
As far as your concern for Manu’s Spurhood, I don’t see this team moving him. There’s just no way to get the kind of return you need on a Manu trade. Also, you can get him for a home town discount at the end of his contract. It just make sense to keep him. The Spurs usually do things that make sense…usually.
by Big50 on Jun 24, 2009 9:38 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Honestly, when i heard about Jefferson coming to Texas, i wasnt thinking abour PERs, salaries, manus future etc,..
All i could think about was an athletic, offensivley gifted wing hitting the wide open threes that were perpetually clanged off the rim by IMe. Or spearing to the hoop for a strong finish if the jumper was well contested.( Something Bruce OR Ime was never able to do, and the biggest reason for our limited offense, i believe)
Now i know Rich just a had a carreer year from downtown, sporting a good but not gawdy 40% accuracy. But there is no way in hell he clangs more threes in 09 than fatality…and his abililty to get to the hoop….man. I am excited.
Round this out with a rebounding big man who can block a shot every so often. And we are back in the WFC at the very least. Likely back in the finals…..
by alamobro on Jun 24, 2009 3:27 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Just tink how good as a shooter Mason has looked while getting open looks on the spurs. His percentage didnt end in the 50% because he is a damn fool that likes to shoot some awful things (and the move to PG didnt help either)
I think Jefferson will see bettter looks from the perimeter than anytime in his career.
Duncan+Manu+Parker = open jefferson
"It's a basic truth of the human condition that everybody lies. The only variable is about what."
by Chilai on Jun 24, 2009 4:50 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
it can go the other way too….
Jefferson can improve the looks of duncan, manu, and parker…do you really want to leave RJ if you are guarding him to double Duncan? We will own you either way so you might as well stay home on RJ and let Duncan embarrass your bigs.
by BlaseE on Jun 24, 2009 6:51 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
man this is good, we only need to stay healthy
"It's a basic truth of the human condition that everybody lies. The only variable is about what."
by Chilai on Jun 24, 2009 7:57 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Chilai, I noticed your nice avatar is back. Or is my browser just failing me the past few weeks?
by silverandblack_davis on Jun 24, 2009 9:42 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I put it back. It doesnt matter how much Powell’s powers try to do (channeling on grandpa’s ATS body), my avatar shall raise again and again from the ashes
"Rock and Roll angels bring that HardRock Hallelujah"
by Chilai on Jun 25, 2009 12:52 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
as much as i enjoy watching turk
he’s a bit of a player that takes too many bad shots.
RJ makes me happy though. i think he’ll be ok. i gonna try to trust pop next season
13 points in 39 seconds. Enough said.
by Duhoh on Jun 27, 2009 4:37 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

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