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A Team Comfortable With Winning

Was there ever a doubt?

You knew the Spurs were gonna step up. You knew it. They have too much pride, too much experience, and yes, too much depth, to lose to a two man team. In retrospect, the only surprising thing about the series was that it took seven games. Blame Tim's flu. Blame Pop not figuring out at the beginning that Peja must be eliminated from the equation. Blame Joey Crawford. Blame the perimeter shooters for bricking wide open three after wide open three in the second halves of the first three road games.

Were the Hornets scary? Hell yes they were scary. They were probably a better squad than any of the four we played last year on our way to the title. But ultimately I think what made them imposing were a couple of factors that seemed more important at the time than they really were.

1. They got off to that 2-0 lead. Yes, that made everyone very nervous. But we led both games at half (as we wound up doing six of seven) even with Duncan clearly not himself and Peja going off. Let's be real about this one. Home court advantage is real. It is a factor. Winning on the road in the playoffs is difficult against good teams. When you start off a series on the road (not something the Spurs have done a lot of in the Big Three Era) sometimes being on the wrong end of 2-0 happens. But despite the history of the thing, I never for one second thought we were done. Not all 2-0s are the same. You have to factor in all those pitiful 7 and 8 seeds that go into that 94%. We were in both games, despite being at a physical and tactical disadvantage.

2. We finally faced a point guard more dangerous/athletic than Tony. Don't underestimate this. One of the reasons the Spurs have been so successful over the years is that going into a series they knew that their point guard was faster and could get more lay-ups than the other team's point guard. We had the athletic mismatch there. Not with New Orleans though. Tony finally met his match with Paul, a guy who could stay with him, step for step, plus they were doubling Timmy to take him out, so it took us a bit to figure out how to attack these guys. I think by putting Bowen on Peja, Pop sent a message to the team: The Hornets don't have more good players than we do. Their best scorer just happens to play point guard. He's still one of only two guys that can create his own shot. Once the Spurs figured out that they're not dealing with an All-Star team here and that the Hornets had the same weaknesses every other team has, they got their collective groove back.

3. The Game 5 loss. A lot of people wrote the Spurs' epitaph when they dropped Game 5 - convincingly - to go down 3-2 for the series. Whenever a series is 2-2, the team that wins the fifth game has an overwhelming edge, even more so when they have home court. But again, I don't think every 3-2 is the same. Look at the Spurs situation when they were down 2-0 realistically. They knew they had to win four out of five. It would've been wildly optimistic, given how good the Hornets are, to expect San Antonio win four in a row. The more manageable scenario to ask of the guys, is to not look at the task at hand as a needing to go on a four game winning streak. Instead break it into two doable clumps - two two game winning streaks. Win two, take a breather, win two. If I told you after Game 2 that the Spurs would win 4-3 and asked you to guess which game we'd lose, everyone would've said Game 5; it's the only logical choice.

Anyway, about the game itself, it certainly was no beauty. Game 7s rarely are. Honestly though, anyone that's upset that Manu shot 6-19 or Tim shot 5-17 or Tony shot 7-17 can just cram it. Some people just don't understand the psychology of a Game 7 between two great teams.  The pressure is immense and the defensive intensity is unparalleled. There is no such thing as an easy basket. The teams have to fight for every inch.

You think this game was ugly? Go look at the box score of our Game 7 Finals win vs. the Pistons. 81-74. We, the winning team, scored one less point there than the Hornets did on Monday. Pray tell you tell me who had a pretty line against Detroit besides Plainview and Roho. Tony scored 8 points, shot 3-11 and had to frequently be subbed with Brent Barry because he was petrified. Tim Duncan shot 10-27 and he was lauded as a postseason hero and Finals MVP afterward. Game 7s aren't easy, people. And this time it was on the road.

But yes, The Big Three struggled. Mightily so. And one could argue that they were bailed out by the role players: Kurt, Fab, Fin, Ime and Robert. Without their efforts we'd surely be fishing right now.

That is one train of thought.

Me? I'm thinking it's about fucking time they did something. Not to sound ungrateful, but let's call a spade a spade for a minute. If these guys played better in the regular season, not only would we have had home court for this series, but in the upcoming one as well. Also, it's not like the six three pointers that Fin, RoHo and Ime hit came as a result of them breaking guys down off the dribble and then hitting step back bombs. No, they were all wide open shots created by - YOU GUESSED IT - the big three. As open as our shooters were all series, me, you or Matthew could've hit a couple with enough attempts. Hell, even Jannero Pargo canned a couple eventually.

Besides, the story of the game was the Spurs defense. Offensively we learned nothing in Game 7. We were still the same crappy ice-cold shooting second half team we were in Games 1,2, and 5 and only managed 40 points, and that's with Manu's freebies in desperation time. I think the whole team got maybe five lay-ups the whole game (two for Tony, one for Tim, Ime, and Kurt). Defense is what won it for us and we shut down the Hornets by clamping down the paint, (except for the occasional lob to Chandler) rotating out to their shooters on threes, and keeping them away from the charity stripe. The disparity in free throws and threes was the difference. And of course, our rebounding was huge,except for that one horrifying memorable sequence late in the 4th when the Hornets took five shots in one possession with Pargo burying the fifth to make it a three point game.

Pop did a lot of things out there to keep the Hornets guessing and on their toes. Every few minutes he would change up the defense. Sometimes Tony was on Paul. Sometimes Bruce. Sometimes Oberto would take West, sometimes it'd be Tim. We gave them a full court press to start off the second half, just to mix it up and get the guys moving so they wouldn't be sluggish. We played their pick-and-roll a variety of ways, sometimes ambushing Paul, sometimes backing off. Really the only thing that seemed to utterly confuse us is when Byron Scott gave Pargo the ball in the 4th quarter - using Paul almost as a decoy - and let him run the show. Nothing else was working for them and for whatever reason, Tony had a hell of a time with Pargo in the 4th. But we held on.

While we had a lot of heroes in Game 7 (all nine guys who played contributed in some fashion, at both ends) you'd have to say that the unsung star of the game for the Spurs was Peja Stojakovic. God was he terrible. He finished 3-11 and about half of his attempts were awful, contested, forced shots. He choked, simple as that. Peja was so frustrated whenever Bruce was guarding him that whenever somebody else like Manu or Ime took a turn, he immediately chucked one up if he got even a crack of daylight, regardless of how far from the basket he was or who else was open. It's never a good thing when the best thing you can say about Stojakovic's night was his defense on Manu, and even that wasn't all that good.

Also, I just want to take a moment to point out, again, that Chris Paul, in addition to being a wonderful basketball player, is a classless bitch punk. He took a lot of cheap shots at our guys this game and again the zebras seemed to look the other way and the broadcasters (Marv Albert and Reggie Miller, naturally) ignored the Golden Boy altogether. In the 3rd quarter while forcing a turnover from Finley, Paul swung his left arm behind the play and hit Fin on the side of the face. On purpose. Look at the film. In the 4th, while scrambling for a loose ball with Ginobili, he basically punched Manu repeatedly in the face until the ref blew a whistle. He hit him clean two, three times. Both of his desperation fouls late, his fifth and sixth, were also rougher than need be. And of course, he didn't shake anyone's hands after the game and made a bee line for the tunnel. Bee line, get it? Ha.

As for our series MVP, while this round wasn't as easy to pick as the last one,  where Tony just discombobulated the Suns, objectively you'd have to give it to Ginobili. He didn't shoot a great percentage, and he treated the paint like it was Chernobyl for much of the series, but he led or tied for the team lead in scoring in four of the games and led or tied in assists in five of the games. He averaged a team high 21.3 points and 6.0 assists and the former is the most he's scored in any series since the Western Conference Finals against Phoenix in '04-'05 (though he put up the exact same avg, also in seven games, against the Mavs in '05-'06) and the latter is a career playoff high. Again, his shooting percentage wasn't great, but you have to factor in how many three point attempts he had, due to how the Hornets were shutting down the paint, and making 40% from three is like making 60% from two. But yes, I agree with Matthew that he'll have to be better against the Lakers.

They all will.

When the game was over Charles Barkley called the Spurs "cockroaches" as in, they always find a way to survive, no matter what. He said it like it was a novel concept but honestly, my BFF Manolis beat him to it by years.

Ever seen the Italian soccer team? Every World Cup, every Euro tournament, it's the same thing.They're not flashy, they don't have the high scoring forwards or that stud midfielder like Zinedine Zidane who makes the game look so easy. They drop one of their early group games and the experts say they're done. But Italy always comes back, always survives as one of top two teams in their group to advance to the knock-out stages, and then they methodically keep advancing. By playing defense. By having role players step up. And yes, by flopping at opportune times. Almost always Italy makes the final. "They're fucking cockroaches, those bastards" Manolis said dismissively in 2006, though he pronounced it "cock-a-roach-es" to get me angry. "You can't get rid of them."

So there you have it, Team Italy, our brothers from another mother. Marco Materazzi, a no-name defenseman for them, became a World Cup hero because he not only scored a header goal off a corner kick against France in the '06 Final, but he successfully got Zidane riled up enough to get ejected from the game, headbutting Materazzi for suggesting that he slept with Zidane's sister. Sounds a bit like Horry's hip check on Steve Nash leading to the S.T.A.T. suspension, huh? The Cockroaches, I like the sound of that. You can't get rid of us, no matter how much the TV executives and the media try.

And all the suits will certainly have their fingers crossed as we face the league's showcase team, the Lakers. For now I choose to believe that we'll get a fair shake from the zebras. If the fix was in Phoenix would be playing L.A. right now for the Shaq-Kobe hype bullshit. If the fix was in Bryant the M.V.P. would be squaring up against his heir apparent in Paul. If the Spurs can make it this far, maybe the league isn't the WWF after all, no matter what the stereotype is.

I for one have a lot of confidence. The Hornets were a much better defensive team than the Lakers. Chandler is a beast in the middle. Their guys communicate well and really jam the paint. Byron Scott gets them to compete hard in their end. The Lakers don't do this. They trust themselves to win games on the other end. I expect Duncan to destroy either Gasol or Odom one-on-one, and he should have ample opportunity since Big Chief Triangle doesn't believe in doubling much. And like Matthew I totally think Tony has to blow by Derek Fisher time and again. Tony has no excuse to not own that match-up. He doesn't have to do anything on defense buy stay with him on the three point line. Fisher will not dribble, he will not penetrate, and he will not run the pick and roll. All he'll do is float on the perimeter. Tony cannot leave him. CANNOT.

The X-Factor as always will be Manu. He shot terribly against L.A. all year but may not have been fully healthy in any of the games. In one memorable game he was the best player on the court despite shooting 3-16. I don't think Kobe will be on him much unless it's close and late. Most of the time it'll be Walton, Radmanovic, Vujacic, etc. I'm not really worried about his individual defender. The screener gets that guy out of the way anyway. I want to see how aggressive Ginobili will go to the paint. I don't think he'll get like seven open three point attempts like last series. On defense he'll have his work cut out for him because the Lakers can post him up with multiple guys. There'll be a lot of Tinyball this series and he, Ime and Fin have to hold their own and rebound.

I'll tell you this much: I believe. With their eighth playoff win the Spurs did more than get by the Hornets. They crossed their proverbial title threshold, the way Moonlight Graham became Doctor Archibald Graham once and for all once he stepped over the 1st base line in "Field of Dreams." Every time The Big Three have won eight playoff games, they've gone on to win the title. Like they say in those stupid split head commercials that run all the time, they know they're close now. They can smell it.

When Craig Sager asked Manu after Game 7 if he'd like to stay as a starter and comfortable there or whether he'd rather go back to the bench, Manu replied, "I'm comfortable with winning, whatever the team needs..." etc. And really, that's the Spurs attitude in general - They're comfortable with winning. They're used to this environment, this pressure. You can beat them once, twice, or even three times, but you can't get rid of them for good. They looked awfully comfy on the road in New Orleans on Monday, didn't they?

P.S. I hate to be self-promoting, but in case anyone cares, here's the link to my last radio appearance, on ESPN Radio, 710 AM in Los Angeles on The Steve Mason show. It was recorded the day of Game 7 and the host, a big time Spurs hater was positive the Hornets would win. We had a good give and take and they invited me back for Wednesday and Friday, 2:25 p.m. Pacific time. It'll be fun to rub it in his face a little. Again, thanks to Matthew for making it possible for me.

P.P.S. I'm sorry I called you a rotting corpse, Fin.

 

 

 

 

 

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i’m with you in being more comfortable about this series as opposed to the last.

do you mind if i say “cock-a-roaches” instead? imagine it said in a raspy voice and a poor italian accent. i have heard that description of our spurs previously and it does fit very well.

cheap shot references including paul and zidane…..perfect. i was really surprised with how much time and effort paul put into throwing himself into people, whacking them mercilessly in loose ball situations and generally not playing straight up basketball. his post game sprint was the stuff of punk for sure.

also agreed 100% on fisher. we cant leave him as all he can do is hit from long range. actually, i think the same of almost every laker except kobe and gasol.

not sure if they will double tim, but they will get picked apart more so that the NOOCH if they do. NOOCH was far superior on defense and had an inside presence on that end of the floor.

loved the post, man – and i’m taking chelsea with drogba scoring the game winner.

by bones on May 21, 2008 6:32 AM CDT   0 recs

You’re underrating Fisher and Odom, you’re underrating Fisher and Odom, you’re underrating Fisher and Odom. I figured if I said it 3 times maybe you guys would listen once. Time will tell, but my prediction is (regardless of who wins series) that Fisher and Odom will have a better series than your predictions seem to allow for. And the idea that Odom is a “hit from the outside” kind of player makes you sound very un-informed. Odom is the least “hit from outside” player we have. He had approx. 16 ppg so far in playoffs and has attempted a total of 5 threes. All of his points are in the paint…..

by pslakerfan on May 21, 2008 11:47 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Aye, I think Odom is your X factor, but about Fisher….seeing the Nuggets and Jazz series, I think Jacksons’ least favorite 4 words are “Fisher off the dribble” just like “Bowen off the dribble” is Pop’s least favorite 4 words. He’ll stay at the 3 pt line, and if we keep someone on him, that minimizes him.

I think it will come down to Odom vs. Ginobili, whoever has the better statistical game, that team will find it a lot easier to win. Another X factor is Kobe, strangely enough….Kobe may be avging 33 in the playoffs, but he typically avgs about 24 with SA (courtesy of ESPN page with the series on it) and about 1/2 his points have come from the charity stripe so far. If SA can turn Kobe into a jump shooter, and not a slasher, I think it will go a long way towards an SA win. If they can’t, then they are in trouble. You can’t deny that Kobe doesn’t get about 95% of the calls for him…esp when you see lines like this (from the Jazz series)

Kobe Bryant, SG 40 8-16 1-2 21-23 0 6 6 7 1 0 3 3 38
Kobe Bryant, SG 41 6-10 1-2 13-17 0 6 6 7 2 0 4 3 2
Kobe Bryant, SG 40 9-19 1-2 15-17 0 8 8 6 0 0 5 4 34

Seems like he went to the line almost the same amount of times as the whole Jazz team in some games, but then again the Jazz LOVE to foul :(

by Nixiack on May 21, 2008 12:09 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Guys ARE pretty much fouling Kobe all the time

But that’s to be expected.

What I’ve noticed is that Tim Duncan is great at just getting arms his straight up, so that even if Kobe gets contact, Kobe won’t get the call.

Bowen is also good at avoiding the fouls calls that Kobe can normally get as he’s shooting, by staying balanced. But before the shot, Bowen is totally all over Kobe and fouling. Sometimes they call that, sometimes they don’t.

by Amazing_Happens on May 21, 2008 12:29 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I agree.........mostly

I agree with most of what you have said except the overall “if” factor. It seems as if a lot of people here have a common theme which is “if”. As in “if someone stays on Fisher at the perimeter” and “if Bowen turns Kobe into a jump shooter” and “if Manu and Odom are a wash” and “if Duncan gets Pau into foul trouble” etc. then the Spurs will beat the Lakers. All of those if’s are possible, but not likely that each will happen each game. I don’t think you will be able to just stay home on Fisher (shooting almost 60% from behind arc in playoffs) while also dealing with Pau, Odom, and Kobe. Not to mention other 3 pt. shooters like Vlad Rad and Vujacic.

If I am being honest here (and maybe a little homeristic) I see a 7 game battle for the ages or a Laker blowout (4 or 5 games). That is just the way I see it. I think the 7 game option is much more likely. Just my opinion, but I really do think you guys are thinking of the old Lakers and believe me the new Lakers are just a completely different team. And I am usually a stick in the mud pessimist myself.

by pslakerfan on May 21, 2008 2:07 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

There's no way

that the Lakers will blow out the Spurs. I’m still waiting for an answer to a question that I asked you in yesterday’s thread: What makes you think that the Lakers will be a tougher opponent for the Spurs than the Hornets were? The Hornets play much better defense than the Lakers. The Lakers actually had the easier half of the draw.

The Lakers’ best chance to win a given game will be tonight [as long as there are no serious injuries later in the series] – if they lose tonight, they are already toast.

by 4Him on May 21, 2008 2:37 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

The Hornets play much better defense than the Lakers?

I don’t know about that one. Lamar Odom is a great help defender, Fisher is compentent, Kobe is great when motivated, and Gasol is Tall. I attended the latest New Orleans-LA regular season game, so heavily based on that, I would not say that New Orleans is a much better defensive team than LA.

by Amazing_Happens on May 21, 2008 4:00 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Jackson's single covering Duncan

It’s been said already by him, and Kobe, that they are going to single cover Duncan because “they don’t want the open man to beat them.” So it will come down to how Duncan can dominate Gasol, and how Parker can get into the lane. Yes…IF…but should the Lakers have to counter and double team Duncan with Odom or Gasol, well the Spurs just had 7 gruelling games of practice vs. that strategy, and it didn’t work against them. Of course, that could be why Jackson is deciding NOT to double Duncan. Should Gasol get into foul trouble, without Bynum there, then yes, I do see a very positive swing to SA’s side.

by Nixiack on May 21, 2008 2:57 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

It works both ways. Not all of us are frightened of the juggernaut that is the mighty lakers.

If Kobe can break the virus-like defense of Bruce Bowen (for not just one game, but a minimum of 4 straight); if Pau forgets that he’s never had the extra gear to rise up and take control of a game (not to mention in a playoff series vs. one of the all-time best defensive big men) and steps up to produce consistantly; if Fisher can somehow shake the D of Parker to drain 3s; if your role players step up large and produce effectively for a minimum of 4 games; if Odom doesn’t cave to pressure and somehow shakes loose a playoff D that he’s yet to see; If Kobe and team stay completely healthy in a brutal, bruising and taxing series; if the SPURS’ age, fatigue and mental exhaustion take over and they get out of rhythm; if the SPURS shooters are off for 4 out of 7 games…............................. then the lakers will beat the SPURS. Funny how homerism tends to cloud your perspective and simultaneously shield your fear.

by SgtinManusArmy on May 21, 2008 3:05 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Golf clap to the Sarge

The homer-istic thinking does work both ways.

Part of continuing to believe in your team is the mental activity of shielding your fear and coming up with enough of the right kind of IFs to convince yourself that your team can come through—while ignoring or reasoning away the IFs that threaten to take your guys down.

So, as the Spurs gear up to take on the next, more difficult, challenge. PtR is tasked with doing the same as the Laker faithful descend upon us—with not a troll among them to be seen.

I’m enjoying the change: instead of telling each other that we can’t wait for the game to start, we’re engaged in discussing differences in the way each fanbase is anticipating the series to play out.

Good stuff.

Everytime the Spurs pass the ball like that, an angel gets its wings. - Hipuks in G6 vs NOOCH

by jollyrogerwilco on May 21, 2008 3:33 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

The Isiah Thomas comparison fits...

not only do their physical stature and their games match to some degree, but remember when Zeke & the Pistons were ousted by the Bulls in 1991? Isiah didn’t shake hands w/the Chi-Town ballaz.
Chris Paul will make a terrible GM

by Gino20 on May 22, 2008 8:20 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Pretty much agree with everything you said. I still remember the feeling of beating Italy at home in the ‘90 WC. Ah, what a day that was. To think I was only 7 years old and I still remember it.

I still think we’re one helluva tough game to beat 4 times out of 7. We’ll see what happens.

Great post, as always. Thanks for sharing.

And bones, ManU with Tevez’s game winner. Yeah, I’m a homer in football, too.

by LatinD on May 21, 2008 8:05 AM CDT   0 recs

Tevez deserves it after playing in that horrible West Ham team.

by Hipuks on May 21, 2008 8:24 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

And saving them from dropping to the B league.

by LatinD on May 21, 2008 8:34 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I was feeling pretty nervous about this series, but after reading your recap I feel a lot better about our chances against LA. The only downside from us winning game 7 is my damn playoff beard that’s really starting to bother, but hey, anything for my team.

by Hipuks on May 21, 2008 8:26 AM CDT   0 recs

That’s a fantastic post, AS. I especially like the “don’t break your arms patting yourself on the back, BenchBitches, it’s about freaking time.” I’m wondering who will be the frequent contributors in LA. I’m past hoping for any consistency from Fin, but I love the new story line that Oduka is writing for himself. We need that for this year, and even more for next. He could/should be an important young piece of our team for next year. (BTW, I’m sorry, Spurs, for my post after Game 2 about Pop ignoring our draft picks too long and us being too old – my bad, please forgive). I think Bowen is ready to keep doing his thing, but PLEASE, only from the Your Spot/Your Shot site – NOTHING ELSE – and how about working Bones back on to the team? I thought he could have really helped us in those losses against the NOOCH.

I too now hate Chris Paul – he’s a dirty bastard little flailing, cheap-shotting, flopmeister. And oh do I hate the idiot Reggie Miller – highlights (lowlights) – “Why would you take out Finley when he’s hot?” Marv: “Uh, perhaps for a little defense with one possession left for NO?” “Now Manu’s getting a taste of his own medicine” (Why didn’t the Hornets get called out for their horrible flopfest? – and we were really under control flop-wise throughout the whole series) There were more idiotic Reggisms but I can’t remember now. He’s really terrible, and dumb.

Did David West remind anyone of Crazy Eyez Killa from Curb? Did you see the promo when Crazy Eyez was with those little kids? Don’t you think they were shitting in their Garanimals?

Can’t wait to beat the Zenbastard. Did you catch Horry’s comment about how Phil never heeded his request for a double on Tim? That’s awesome, we’re totally winning.

Remember the Simulator Crew! Beat the Lakers!

by fliprose on May 21, 2008 8:37 AM CDT   0 recs

Stampizzle, as the authoritative FinDog fan on the site, your apology to FinDog has not been accepted yet. Calling a man a rotting corpse in the playoffs? You are going to have to go further and step to with an in game, “FinnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnDoggggggggggggggggggggggggggg!!!!!!!”.

Great recap.

by AusTechSpur on May 21, 2008 8:39 AM CDT   0 recs

I can’t tell you how much I enjoy reading these analyses by Aaron and Matthew. You guys really know basketball and despite your love for the Spurs, you don’t hesitate to be critical of the players and coaches when it is warranted. I could do without some of the profanity, but again the analyses are great and fun to read.

One thing Pop says a lot is that in the playoffs your stars have to play well for the team to win. I think the farther you go in the playoffs, the more this is true. I believe that if the Spurs’ stars play well, they will win. I think that Manu, Tim and Tony are collectively better than anything the Lakers can throw out there. But all 3 have to play well to win this series.

It is interesting that in the 2 Spurs losses to LA on the road, they were short-handed. They should have won in LA without Tim and Tony, and later they got blown out without Manu. In the Spurs 2 wins the Lakers didn’t have Gasol. So no one really knows how these teams will look against each other at full strength.

I agree with the comment that the Spurs should have a new sense of confidence after the win against NO. I think they have what it takes to win this series and that their experience and resolve will carry them through.

Thanks again to all who contribute to this board. It really makes it fun to be a Manu and Spurs fan.

by Minnesota on May 21, 2008 8:42 AM CDT   0 recs

Yeah, only on PtR is Manu a god…And in Argentina…and in San Antonio…But, still, a lot of the b-ball world hates him. Nice to see so many people share my, ahem, love for him

by Gino20 on May 22, 2008 8:40 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Speaking as fans

Don’t the Spurs fans have more to lose? I pose it this way, because the players don’t care so much what the public has to say.

Say the Spurs lose the series, you will have panic that the team is getting “old”, that “changes need to be made”, no?

On the other hand, if the Lakers lose, it’s “next year will be our time”, “we’ll have Bynum”, etc. Of course, Lakers fans will have to deal with “This is why Kobe can’t lead a team to a championship” articles and”Kobe is not the MVP”, “Kobe sucks” stuff. But we’ll still have next year.

Not trash talk, just something interesting to think about before the games start. And will they please start already?

by Amazing_Happens on May 21, 2008 11:34 AM CDT   0 recs

Well, the truth is that like every other team out there, the Spurs are aging. After we lost to the Mavs in the second round in ‘06, everyone said the Spurs were too old an unathletic to ever be a contender again. Yet we all know what happened in ‘07. Pop is not going to “panic” because some idiot says the team is too old. Win or lose this season, the Duncan era is not over. There is still a great core in place, and room to add new help.

An athletic and gifted PF, the 6’10” Ian Mahinimi will likely be on the teams roster next season (spent most of the season with the Toros). Also, the athletic and defensive minded (though apparently his offense has improved greatly too) 7’ C Tiago Splitter will likely be brought in from Tau Ceramica.

Finley, Vaughn, Damon, Horry, and Kurt Thomas all come off the books. DerMarr Johnson also does, but he is really there to be a summer league player to see if he can make ther roster. All those departures will equal cap space for the Spurs and they should make a run at signing an verstatile and athletic free agent wing player like Josh Childress. Thomas also might be re-signed for a minimum contract. The only dead weight we will have on the roster (and this is arguable) is Matt Bonner and he only costs the Spurs 3 million per year. Also, who knows if he won’t eventually work out as a role player?

By all appearances next season’s incarnation of the Spurs could easily be better than the ‘08 version. Even if the Lakers manage to squeak by the Spurs this year, it is too early for you to breath easy.

by VWolf on May 21, 2008 11:57 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

AmazingHappens, there’s a good article over at Deadspin previewing the series that talks about just this idea of how much a team has to lose and how it could affect the series.

http://deadspin.com/5010181/free-darko-on-los-angeles+san-antonio
(I'm not affiliated with the site or anything. Just a good read and thought I'd pass it along.)

Allez Spurs!

by JustinBK on May 21, 2008 1:12 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I don’t know what happened up there. I still have yet to figure out all the quirks in the new system here.

Allez Spurs!

by JustinBK on May 21, 2008 1:13 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Thanks

I agree with the premise, the Spurs do have more to lose as a team. I think the only player on the Lakers with more to lose is Kobe, because the Kobe-Hate will be out in full force if his team loses. Then again, he hears about it every time he has a bad game, so that’s probably what motivates him all the time anyway.

Los Angeles media and the players are giving San Antonio much respect right now. Although it would be easy to say “look the Hornets took Spurs to seven games”, I don’t know many Lakers fans taking the Spurs lightly.

by Amazing_Happens on May 21, 2008 1:20 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Exactly

I couldn’t agree more, the Spurs definitely have more to lose. At least as far as perception or the media are concerned. The Spurs will hear “dynasty over”, “too old”, etc. if they lose. The Lakers (other than Kobe who will be grilled) will hear “wait until next year with a healthy team”, etc….

For the record the Lakers will be ridiculously good next year. Take it to the bank. Assuming reasonable health of course….

When Bynum becomes the Western conference version of Dwight Howard, remember where you heard it first.

by pslakerfan on May 21, 2008 2:11 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

So much talk about Bynum

We can just hope he comes back to peak condition after that knee injury. To be sidelined for so long and THEN finally decide “surgery is best” isn’t the best thing in the world to hear, and we’ve already had a mild discussion regarding the Laker med staff on another thread.

My question is this…..what happens with Odom/Gasol? Honestly. Gasol by his nature will take Bynum’s stats out of the equation, and if he’s THAT good, he will take Gasol out of it a bit. It’s just nature. For Bynum to be Dwight Howard, he will be the focal point of that offense(like Howard is to the Magic)....if Bynum is your focal point, when you have Gasol-not to mention Kobe-in his prime, well that is bad. I see him at best as a younger Odom, honestly. And that does not bode well for Odom. Who knows, maybe Odom is FINALLY playing up to his potential because with Gasol there,and Bynum coming back, he knows he’s the odd man out.

by Nixiack on May 21, 2008 3:00 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Great question

Nobody knows what Bynum’s return (next year at best) will do to the Laker lineup. Of course it is an assumption that they will be able to play together well. I don’t think Pau and Bynum will be a problem as much as Pau and Odom will. Adding Bynum will move Odom further from the basket where he does not excel. Only time will tell.

As for the Dwight Howard issue, obviously Bynum will not get the touches that Howard does, however as a PER for instance (hollinger is still and idiot) I think they are very very similar.

I know a lot of non Laker fans don’t know much of Bynum, but if you were to research it his pre-injury stats per 48 minutes were just sick. Ahead of Dwight Howard across the board….

by pslakerfan on May 21, 2008 4:26 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

So again, what else is new? I’ve heard ‘they’re old’ with this team since ‘05. Two rings since then. Eventually yeah, they’ll be too old to play, but using that argument is weak considering that it’s a catch-22. You wouldn’t think me a prophet if I claimed that one day, some time in the near future, another Pacific coast volcano would happen. “It could happen this year.” Yeah, but if it doesn’t, I’m still safe since when it does finally occur, I can claim I was at the forefront predicting it and warning everyone in 2008. They’re old keeps consistantly getting shot down, even as the team ages beyond all understanding.

We’ve ALWAYS had more to lose. The sky is falling, the sky is falling. Not many true SPURS fans are actually worried, we trust the most brilliant and most proven front office in the NBA to provide for us.

Another clever aspect of this arguement, when you lose you’ve already given yourself and your team an out. Injuries killed you this year, if the deck wasn’t stacked against you it would have been different. This just in- every team has an excuse if they look hard enough. It only exposes a fan base as cowardly and shallow to set up fall-back reasoning for a possible loss, before Game 1 has even been played!! What happens if King Bynum returns next year and you guys choke in the first round, fully intact? Are you going to be confused and uncertain? Should the team be blown up? Was there some other important piece conspiring against your run? No, that’s ridiculous. Win and lose on the floor, not in a pre-game blog.

by SgtinManusArmy on May 21, 2008 3:16 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Absolutely SiMA. I am reminded of Mavs fans who were oh so confident that they would be back in the championship picture after slipping up against the Heat. I warned them that it was a long road back to the finals and that there were no guarantees, but they thought their team was destined to go again (since the Spurs gorilla was now off their backs). And we all know what happened there.

Caution to you Laker fans. What might seem like the beginings of a new dynasty could just be the flavor of the season. Gasol and Kobe could eventually feud. Bynum could never return to decent form. Fish could finally feel the age and you could have a tough time finding a replacement. Twixt the cup and the lip, there’s many a slip.

by VWolf on May 21, 2008 3:21 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

VWolf – bringing the Shakespeare. That’s not often seen in these parts.

Nicely done.

Everytime the Spurs pass the ball like that, an angel gets its wings. - Hipuks in G6 vs NOOCH

by jollyrogerwilco on May 21, 2008 3:42 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Just glad the Spurs can't play the "disrespect" angle

There doesn’t seem to be much disrespecting going on in the media (well, you can take their predictions as “disrespect” but even they would tell you they’re not all that sure of the outcome, but were forced to make a pick).

I’m not sure why some Spurs fans would say that us Lakers fans expect you to be “frightened of the juggernaut that is the mighty Lakers”. If anything, the Lakers are admitting that you must go through the defending champs to win, and giving them proper consideration.

Spurs fans seem to be a confident bunch to me, especially for a 3 seed facing a 1 seed. Would it be so hard to admit that the Lakers are a formidable foe? I can see either side winning this one, although of course, I will be rooting for the Lakers.

by Amazing_Happens on May 21, 2008 4:11 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Amazing that’s a great point. The Lakers are formidable for sure, but that doesn’t make me any less confident that the Spurs will win the series. I’m sure you feel the same way about the Lakers. That’s why sports is so great, so many different viewpoints and I enjoy discussing them. Damn, is it game time yet?

I never met anybody who said when they were a kid, "I wanna grow up and be a critic." - Richard Pryor

by DennardC on May 21, 2008 4:23 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

3 seed facing a 1 seed eh?

They were 1 game apart. If Manu was healthy and SA gave a crap (they came out and said they were more concerned with health than seeding) and they won the game at the end of the season vs. LA, they would be the #1 seed, LA would be the 3 seed. So I wouldn’t give that much credence.

by Nixiack on May 21, 2008 4:25 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Home Court Seems Important Now, Doesn't It?

Or do you think the Spurs just like to do things the hard way?

by Amazing_Happens on May 21, 2008 4:29 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Not necessarily. They’ve won chips with homecourt through out and they’ve won chips w/o. A truly great team doesn’t rely on homecourt. I remember the 2001 Lakers, they didn’t have homecourt throughout and they beat hell out the Spurs that season.

I never met anybody who said when they were a kid, "I wanna grow up and be a critic." - Richard Pryor

by DennardC on May 21, 2008 4:32 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

You know, it may help to be on the road ...

Because I think that the first team to lose a home game is going to be in trouble.

So, say Spurs lose both games, there’s still no reason to panic for the Spurs, but if the Lakers lose one of the first two, uh oh… so it’s almost as if all the pressure is on the Lakers to win the first two, while a win would just be a bonus for the Spurs.

by Amazing_Happens on May 21, 2008 4:39 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

This aint new baby.

Since 1999 the Spurs have played in 28 playoff series and there have been only 3 series where we haven’t won on the road. 25 out of 28 series the Spurs have taken one or more on the road for a combined 40 road playoff wins. I love our chances.

Superman wears Manu Ginobili pajamas to bed.

by CMoney on May 21, 2008 5:35 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Health?

If we had Bynum and Ariza all season (our 3rd and 6th best players respectively) this wouldn’t even be an issue.

by pslakerfan on May 21, 2008 4:33 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

You’re assuming that LA would have been able to incorporate Gasol onto the team and Odom and Bynum and Ariza without any repercussions or issues

I’m not saying that there would have been issues. I am saying that you can’t assume that there wouldn’t have been. Each team had the season that they had and nothing can be changed from the past season.

IFs looking forward to this series—sure. But IFs looking back to the past regular season … c’mon. Nobody’s going to win that argument

Everytime the Spurs pass the ball like that, an angel gets its wings. - Hipuks in G6 vs NOOCH

by jollyrogerwilco on May 21, 2008 4:37 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

You talk up Ariza a lot, and I do think he is a nice player, but when he was healthy he only started 3 games, and he was used fairly sparingly in some others. Do you think he has earned Phil’s trust so quickly? You know how PJ likes him some veterans.

by VWolf on May 21, 2008 4:39 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Ariza

Looked very fluid within the Lakers system, in that he played good defense, and on offense he didn’t need the ball, he was very good moving without it, and he even made some good reads when he did get the ball, passing to cutters.

by Amazing_Happens on May 21, 2008 4:41 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Ariza’s a player. Trust me. He is going to be a All-NBA defender in the near future.

I never met anybody who said when they were a kid, "I wanna grow up and be a critic." - Richard Pryor

by DennardC on May 21, 2008 4:46 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Yes, but that near future does not include this series.

by VWolf on May 21, 2008 5:09 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Oh no. He won’t be a factor in this series, but he’s gonna be hell for a while. Dude is only like what 22-23? Damn the Lakers are gonna be STACKED the next 4-5 years.

I never met anybody who said when they were a kid, "I wanna grow up and be a critic." - Richard Pryor

by DennardC on May 21, 2008 5:11 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Well they do have some contract work cut out for them to carry it out to 4-5 years.

Ariza, Bynum, and Odom all have only 1 season left.

Kobe and Gasol have 3 seasons left after this one.

by VWolf on May 21, 2008 5:18 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Yeah, but Jerry Buss doesn’t care about the luxury tax. They are going to have it worked out. I’m not going to look at the salary structure and all that, but due to my cynical nature I have to believe that the NBA i.e. David Stern, this team will be a factor as long as Kobe is still a big money ticket. Especially after the fiasco with Shaq.

I never met anybody who said when they were a kid, "I wanna grow up and be a critic." - Richard Pryor

by DennardC on May 21, 2008 5:26 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Playing the disrespect angle

Amazing, that really would be hilarious. Seeing TD hoisting some trophy, with a scowl on his face as he says, “We knew it was us against the world. Nobody believed in us. Everyone was saying we couldn’t do it. In between calling us a dynasty and the team of the decade, lots of guys wrote stories about how we were too old and slow. And someone even predicted that we would lose against some of the teams we played. But we didn’t. And now we repeated. In your face!”

I don’t think that that any of the Spurs are particularly motivated about proving anyone in the media wrong.

That said, most of the guys here probably would echo your sentiments of “I can see either side winning this one, although of course, I will be rooting for the Lakers Spurs.”

Everytime the Spurs pass the ball like that, an angel gets its wings. - Hipuks in G6 vs NOOCH

by jollyrogerwilco on May 21, 2008 4:30 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Great point

I find the “arrogance” of this blog to be a little strange. Maybe unexpected is the right word. I put arrogance in quotes because I am not sure that is the right word. Maybe myopic is better. Who knows? I guess you have earned the right to be arrogant, but I just hope that arrogance doesn’t turn into a bunch of lame excuses when and if we win.

by pslakerfan on May 21, 2008 4:30 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

One man’s ironclad logic is another’s lame excuse.

What kinds of things are you referring to as “arrogance”? I think most of the posters here are acknowledging that LA won’t be tough to beat, but that we think the Spurs can do it.

Just not sure what it is that you’re seeing.

Everytime the Spurs pass the ball like that, an angel gets its wings. - Hipuks in G6 vs NOOCH

by jollyrogerwilco on May 21, 2008 4:32 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Man that was a fast response!!!

Apparently I am seeing a typo, because you just said “we here are acknowledging that LA “WONT” be tough to beat”.

I guess we are all seeing things through our own homer glasses because all I see are posts about how we can’t contain anyone on your team, and you can contain all of our players.

It’s hard to believe we should even play the games. Spurs in 0. Yeah…...

Gotta get going to Staples, see you later….

by pslakerfan on May 21, 2008 4:37 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

yup, that was a typo, shoulda been

”... that LA will be touch to beat”

Everytime the Spurs pass the ball like that, an angel gets its wings. - Hipuks in G6 vs NOOCH

by jollyrogerwilco on May 21, 2008 4:39 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

arrrgh —not even going to try again

I think you understand me

Everytime the Spurs pass the ball like that, an angel gets its wings. - Hipuks in G6 vs NOOCH

by jollyrogerwilco on May 21, 2008 4:40 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

One those days

It’s ok, I walked into a glass sliding door yesterday.

by Amazing_Happens on May 21, 2008 4:42 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

You also said yesterday...

But the Spurs winning the series in 6 would require them to win at least 2 games in L.A. It would seem more realistic for them to win in 7. I’m just sayin’.

by Amazing_Happens on May 20, 2008 9:44 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Superman wears Manu Ginobili pajamas to bed.

by CMoney on May 21, 2008 5:50 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Yes I did

And I was wrong. Thank you for bringing up my past mistakes. Please, now post one time you were wrong to balance it out.

by Amazing_Happens on May 21, 2008 5:52 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs